Do you currently have a Kraftwerks Supercharger installed? I have a few questions

[mit_peid]

I think D K and the CSG guys really don't like KW and will always push JR

[Freeman]

Originally Posted by mit_peid

I think D K and the CSG guys really don't like KW and will always push JR

Thats obvious

[mit_peid]

Makes you wonder the terms of that exclusivity agreement between vendor (JR) and retailer/marketer (CSG).

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by mit_peid

Makes you wonder the terms of that exclusivity agreement between vendor (JR) and retailer/marketer (CSG).

There isn't any. We sell products we feel comfortable backing, based on the quality of the product itself and our own testing results.

You won't see us selling XXR, Rota, or SPD either.

Really, the owner's threads for the kits say it all.

[Freeman]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

There isn't any. We sell products we feel comfortable backing, based on the quality of the product itself and our own testing results.

That's awesome. So where have you guys published the results of your testing on the Kraftwerks kit? I'm excited to read it.

[D K]

Originally Posted by mit_peid

I think D K and the CSG guys really don't like KW and will always push JR

For me, its not really liking or disliking.

They both use the same compressor - probably the best one on the planet.

So the liking or disliking comes from the way the kit is put together.

Rotrex warns to stay away from cogged belts. I mean how much more clear do you want to be?

In OTHER supercharger kits, cogged belts have caused problems in a roadracing application (i.e. Other than drag racing).

KW is onown to release products without testing them.

You can buy the 38 kit from them - have they tested it even? Is it reliable?

I really dont care what people buy.
I just feel like everyone should be informed so they can make buying decisions based on facts and not sales fluff.

I hope more people buy superchargers and track their cars. The more of us out there, the quicker the development curve.

D

[D K]

^ ^ ^

Originally Posted by Freeman

Thats obvious

[Sellout]

Originally Posted by D K

For me, its not really liking or disliking.

They both use the same compressor - probably the best one on the planet.

So the liking or disliking comes from the way the kit is put together.

Rotrex warns to stay away from cogged belts. I mean how much more clear do you want to be?

In OTHER supercharger kits, cogged belts have caused problems in a roadracing application (i.e. Other than drag racing).

KW is onown to release products without testing them.

You can buy the 38 kit from them - have they tested it even? Is it reliable?

I really dont care what people buy.
I just feel like everyone should be informed so they can make buying decisions based on facts and not sales fluff.

I hope more people buy superchargers and track their cars. The more of us out there, the quicker the development curve.

D

Oscar? Is that you?

Originally Posted by D K

I heard it directly from Rotrex.

If I go onto the Rotrex website and click on the contact link, I see that they want nothing to do with me unless I'm a distributor or OEM. Maybe that is Oscar...

[D K]

Originally Posted by Sellout

Oscar? Is that you?



If I go onto the Rotrex website and click on the contact link, I see that they want nothing to do with me unless I'm a distributor or OEM. Maybe that is Oscar...

No.

You can get through if you tried hard enough.
I did.

At first I was planning on designing my own kit with a cog belt (and a multiple speed gearbox) but that got ixnayed due to the fact that Rotrex didnt support the idea.

I dont work for either company. I just want to inform others to what I found in my search.

[loogs]

Originally Posted by glamcem

Bob from @Drift-Office recently posted a SC shootout which you may find interesting
For the record, he is a very reputable tuner and I agree with his opinions


http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1624913

so he picks the KW kit barely over the JR kit. a few days ago i was 99.99% sure i was doing the KW kit. then after all this and hearing about the oil cooler, i changed my mind and said im doing the JR kit. now after reading the latest info, im even more confused.

really the thing that has me scared the most is the oil cooler issue. i do about 11k a year, daily drive my car and plan on doing auto x maybe 10-20 times a year. probably wont ever do track but i also said i would never do auto x when i first got this car so who knows. i do live in NY where it gets really cold but i dont drive my car when its really cold out anyway. keep the info coming and thanks to everyone who have chimed in.

[ATL BRZ]

Originally Posted by loogs

so he picks the KW kit barely over the JR kit. a few days ago i was 99.99% sure i was doing the KW kit. then after all this and hearing about the oil cooler, i changed my mind and said im doing the JR kit. now after reading the latest info, im even more confused.

really the thing that has me scared the most is the oil cooler issue. i do about 11k a year, daily drive my car and plan on doing auto x maybe 10-20 times a year. probably wont ever do track but i also said i would never do auto x when i first got this car so who knows. i do live in NY where it gets really cold but i dont drive my car when its really cold out anyway. keep the info coming and thanks to everyone who have chimed in.

Check out this thread for some more good info: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55705

Pay close attention to the update at the bottom of the first post. There's a "reported issues per month" chart that you may find helpful in your decision.

Since you're now considering the JR SC kit as well, I'll add some of my thoughts on it as it is without question my top choice for FI in the future.

If you're looking for a Rotrex kit with a completely flawless track record since release, and a full plug and play thermostatic oil cooler, JR is it.

Intake air temperatures with the JR kit have been measured to be lower than stock in Southern California so you'll actually have more convenience for air filter changes and no headaches removing the bumper as you inevitably would with the KW kit. I think JR determined in testing (of which they did a lot of; on and off track) that there is no need to have a filter outside the engine bay since the intercooler is doing all the work anyways.

The JR kit is far simpler by design and will take considerably less labor time to install. It's also worth mentioning that the JR kit is CARB approved and the KW is not. That may not matter now but you never know how emissions laws may change in the future. It's nice to know the CARB tune is available and you can have a street legal car in 50 states.

[D K]

Look at the torque curve from 4500 on.....

Besides the oil cooler issue, whats actually 'better' on the KW kit?

Originally Posted by loogs

so he picks the KW kit barely over the JR kit. a few days ago i was 99.99% sure i was doing the KW kit. then after all this and hearing about the oil cooler, i changed my mind and said im doing the JR kit. now after reading the latest info, im even more confused.

really the thing that has me scared the most is the oil cooler issue. i do about 11k a year, daily drive my car and plan on doing auto x maybe 10-20 times a year. probably wont ever do track but i also said i would never do auto x when i first got this car so who knows. i do live in NY where it gets really cold but i dont drive my car when its really cold out anyway. keep the info coming and thanks to everyone who have chimed in.

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by loogs

so he picks the KW kit barely over the JR kit. a few days ago i was 99.99% sure i was doing the KW kit. then after all this and hearing about the oil cooler, i changed my mind and said im doing the JR kit. now after reading the latest info, im even more confused.

really the thing that has me scared the most is the oil cooler issue. i do about 11k a year, daily drive my car and plan on doing auto x maybe 10-20 times a year. probably wont ever do track but i also said i would never do auto x when i first got this car so who knows. i do live in NY where it gets really cold but i dont drive my car when its really cold out anyway. keep the info coming and thanks to everyone who have chimed in.

I know you mentioned that you don't want to read the whole thread and I understand it's a very long thread but I would definitely spend some time reading it since it's a big investment/decision, you mentioned that you will be using your car for the street (for the most part) so have you ever considered other alternatives such as Electric Superchargers?

I am not kidding, it's the future of the charger designs and the current chargers will be obsolete sooner or later .. and It looks like a great
budget-oriented upgrade for those who will use the car for street (most of the time) and a few auto-x events.. at the end it's cheap, no parasitic loss (unlike superchargers), good way to rid of the TQ dip and easy install/uninstall and probably a lot safer for the engines..of course someone will argue about that and say you get what you pay for .. but if it wasn't for the road course track events I would definitely go with that route, but that's just me ..

I personally don't like any sort of FI option that is not made my manufacturers/OEM , I prefer NA for track use and wish I had a bigger engine in my car but that's just me... but I had to utilize some sort of less heat generating, track friendly SC kit since that is the only area this car falls short..

for the street though, I have to admit turbo is a lot more fun imo, AVO turbo might be another good alternative with OEM-like design and people seem to like that because of the area under the torque curve and the power delivery (turbo kick is fun).. even with big V8 power people who sit in my Vettes felt the car is a bit boring, compared the TCd cars.. because smoother, predictable power delivery is not thrilling I guess ( of course that absurdity will cost you a lot of time at track ) but fun vs better time,, who can argue with one's decision about that?

maybe you should do your homework a bit more before pulling the trigger on X kit, at the end of the day it's your hard earned money ( I assume) ..

if you are pretty much set on a Rotrex unit I'd say difference between two offerings are marginal but may be important for someone who wants to track his/hers car and that's the reason why I picked KW over JR

bigger IC, IC piping, ability to drive back home if belt snaps because of the dedicated belt unlike the JR unit and of course the real COLD air intake I know many will say it doesn't matter once the car passes say 30 mph but I will suggest the otherwise because of my previous experience with the engine bay intakes.. and why compromise anyways? and guess what it costs even less with the group buy ( I paid more than the group buy pricing)

Let's be honest though, JR did a great job with providing awesome installation manual, possibly paid more attention to the QC when packing stuff and their oil cooler looks really good and have been available longer than the KW .. KW's installation instructions could be better but I think they listened the owners and updated that too.. I also had no problem communicating with them when I needed the upgraded pulleys (free of charge)

After all these years trying different type of sports cars and been an active member on different forums I noticed one thing you get a lot of biased information from brand loyal guys (fanboys) or even worse "echo" from people who are in reality clueless about the actual topic .. it's really hard to argue about a person who wears a Subaru t-shirt (and that comes from a guy who owned 3-4 different Subarus and never owned a tshirt haha)you .. so maybe you may speak with reputable tuners, track junkies to get unbiased info and search and search some more..
I would highly suggest you to read the owner's threads on both kits and try to gather information from people

1- who is not a vendor/affiliated with the manufacturer since ..you know it's business and no one can blame those folks for that
2- who actually owns the kit with a first hand experience (remember the "echo" guys, who know someone who knows who owns the kit and testing it )
3- who actually beat the shit of the car with it ..someone who sees some serious track time and doing a stress test for you .. free of charge (there are a few , ahem)

Originally Posted by ATL BRZ

Check out this thread for some more good info: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55705

Pay close attention to the update at the bottom of the first post. There's a "reported issues per month" chart that you may find helpful in your decision.

as a data analyst with a statistical background I have to say that it is one of the worst representation of data I've seen for a while it's more like a "BroScience" yes, someone who works at Kraftwerks (packaging) kits made a mistake and forgot to include some bolts and whatnot but does that make the overall kit less reliable? seriously? how about we talk about some more dramatic differences in design that I mentioned above..

I think both JR and KW are great kits so no need to cheer for one of them and dissing the other

Intake air temperatures with the JR kit have been measured to be lower than stock in Southern California so you'll actually have more convenience for air filter changes and no headaches removing the bumper as you inevitably would with the KW kit. I think JR determined in testing (of which they did a lot of; on and off track) that there is no need to have a filter outside the engine bay since the intercooler is doing all the work anyways.

there is always need to have a filter outside of the engine bay, always..hence the word "COLD" air intake

[glamcem]

Originally Posted by D K

Look at the torque curve from 4500 on.....

Besides the oil cooler issue, whats actually 'better' on the KW kit?

they actually know the janitor and a few other people at Rotrex maybe?