TMP track times

[GibbsFRS]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

So basically what I’m seeing here is, there’s no one to corroborate Drew’s claim of there being many stock FR-S around 1:19-1:20?

Not that I know of, if he indeed meant "stock."

[Frost]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

So basically what I’m seeing here is, there’s no one to corroborate Drew’s claim of there being many stock FR-S around 1:19-1:20?

Unless he brings you proper proof (ie: time attack results or in car videos or something that can be fact checked), I have at least 2 people I know who are acutely tuned to the FRS platform and have driven it on TMP to say what a stock FRS + suspension + alignment + tires can do and we are all in agreement that 1:19 is not happening let alone MULTIPLE different drivers doing it.

[n0thing]

Perhaps we are just slow drivers

[Frost]

Originally Posted by n0thing

Perhaps we are just slow drivers

I've never said I was fast, just officially not the slowest

[Tokay444]

Maybe we ought to buy some driving lessons from Drewpy...

[Frost]

Originally Posted by Tokay444

Maybe we ought to buy some driving lessons from Drewpy...

Here's some freebies!

https://www.melonsbetterdriving.com/...rs-secret-tool

[Tokay444]

LAWL. I’m going Friday and expecting to hit the 1:19 mark that lots of other stock FR-Ss are at.

[aimforapex]

Originally Posted by Frost

Here's some freebies!

https://www.melonsbetterdriving.com/...rs-secret-tool

I glance through the article and find this sentence, which is baffling..

"Do they have neutral steer? Or excessive under- or over-steer? Understeer and oversteer are slow. Avoid like the plague. Neutral steer, where a car simply grips with all four tires equally is the most ideal situation."

What is Neutral Steer? does he mean do not EVER drive on the limit of the tire? how is that driving fast if we don't drive at the peak limit of the tire?

No car ever grip all four tires equally, due to braking, throttle. its the basics of weight transfer. weight will transfer front, back and lateral, 4 tires will never have equally the same grip.

nvm im ranting...if he claim to be a driving instructor, I think he needs to fact check himself before putting out false information that won't help anyone who is new to the sport.

my 2 cents.

[PearlAozora]

Originally Posted by aimforapex

I glance through the article and find this sentence, which is baffling..

"Do they have neutral steer? Or excessive under- or over-steer? Understeer and oversteer are slow. Avoid like the plague. Neutral steer, where a car simply grips with all four tires equally is the most ideal situation."

What is Neutral Steer? does he mean do not EVER drive on the limit of the tire? how is that driving fast if we don't drive at the peak limit of the tire?

No car ever grip all four tires equally, due to braking, throttle. its the basics of weight transfer. weight will transfer front, back and lateral, 4 tires will never have equally the same grip.

nvm im ranting...if he claim to be a driving instructor, I think he needs to fact check himself before putting out false information that won't help anyone who is new to the sport.

my 2 cents.

Couldn’t agree more with your analysis. If you’re not under/oversteering I feel you’re never truly pushing your limit as a driver or the cars limit itself.

But I’m no seasoned vet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[wparsons]

No, that's actually an accurate statement for the most part. If you're under or over steering a lot you're scrubbing speed. Ideally the slip angle of the tire is in the happy zone (differs per tire), and you're not plowing straight ahead or hanging the tail way out. "Neutral" steering doesn't mean the tires can't be slipping a bit, just that you're not way over driving one end of the car.

There's a big difference between a tiny bit of under/over steer (which might shift between both throughout a single corner) and excessive amounts.

The bit about all 4 tires gripping equally isn't accurate, and his wording could be better, but the rest isn't bad.

[aimforapex]

Originally Posted by wparsons

No, that's actually an accurate statement for the most part. If you're under or over steering a lot you're scrubbing speed. Ideally the slip angle of the tire is in the happy zone (differs per tire), and you're not plowing straight ahead or hanging the tail way out. "Neutral" steering doesn't mean the tires can't be slipping a bit, just that you're not way over driving one end of the car.

There's a big difference between a tiny bit of under/over steer (which might shift between both throughout a single corner) and excessive amounts.

The bit about all 4 tires gripping equally isn't accurate, and his wording could be better, but the rest isn't bad.

ya for sure, playing on the edge once in a while and keeping the car within traction circle is ideally.

but the way he words it, make it seems like you have to drive 7/10 at all times.

[Tokay444]

The guy obviously knows what he's talking about.
I mean, if an S2K can run 1:19, it only stands to reason that there would be lots of FR-Ss around 1:19-1:20...

[Frost]

Originally Posted by wparsons

No, that's actually an accurate statement for the most part. If you're under or over steering a lot you're scrubbing speed. Ideally the slip angle of the tire is in the happy zone (differs per tire), and you're not plowing straight ahead or hanging the tail way out. "Neutral" steering doesn't mean the tires can't be slipping a bit, just that you're not way over driving one end of the car.

There's a big difference between a tiny bit of under/over steer (which might shift between both throughout a single corner) and excessive amounts.

The bit about all 4 tires gripping equally isn't accurate, and his wording could be better, but the rest isn't bad.

From a writing perspective, the article was a little discombobulated and goes on and on to deliver very little. It's not necessarily wrong but at the same time not fully right either which is what I hate about topics that have scientific facts and hard science. If it were a subjective topic (as opposed to objective topic), I can sort of appreciate the way it was written.

Originally Posted by aimforapex

ya for sure, playing on the edge once in a while and keeping the car within traction circle is ideally.

but the way he words it, make it seems like you have to drive 7/10 at all times.

This goes back to what I said about the writing. As someone who also writes, its a bit of a hot mess at times and not what I would necessarily point a newbie to.

[Tokay444]

It’s the word steering being miss used. You want a car that’s neutral handling at the limits of adhesion, in order to be quick. No one that excessively oversteers or understeers.