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Old 08-01-2013, 11:02 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fatoni View Post
i just wanted to point out that a company that makes a great shock, will not give you trouble in finding shock dynos.
This isn't necessarily true. Ohlins and KW are both very protective of their shock dynos. Both have a few general "marketing" dynos but it's difficult to find one for a specific model. They have legitimate concerns about releasing that data in a marketplace that's full of copycats and ripoff companies that do none of their own R&D.

Not saying I agree with it 100% but it's their choice and I see where they are coming from.

For me dynos are a GREAT starting point...they don't tell the whole story BUT they do give you a pretty good idea of what's going on. Especially with a "real" dyno and not a "marketing" dyno. It's a start, and when you add seat time getting to know each company's unique "flavors" over the past decade, I have a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn't. Things can change with a company (for better or worse) and as CSG said, actually driving on them is pretty darn important.

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Old 08-01-2013, 11:44 AM   #16
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Also, I highly recommend reading the Penske shock manual. It is awesome information.

Here:
http://www.penskeshocks.com/files/Adjustable_Manual.pdf

Awesome explanation of what is happening inside a (very good) shock for compression and rebound. Also some damper tuning tips. Read it and love it. And remember not all shocks are like that inside, but it's still awesome to read.

- Andy
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Old 08-01-2013, 11:46 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering View Post
Also, I highly recommend reading the Penske shock manual. It is awesome information.

- Andy
I was thinking of linking that... but a lot of it is gonna be mumbo jumbo... hell, a lot of it is still mumbo jumbo to me.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:18 PM   #18
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Quantifying shock valving is pretty tricky. It's not something that I can explain or hope to ever get my head around. I understand what is happening in the graphs, but what makes one better than the other is beyond me. It's kind of black magic.

With springs and sways, it's fairly easy to see what happens and to even model it.

Personally, I go off of branding. I know that's not the right answer, but I'll go for a Koni / Bilstein / Moton over an unfamiliar brand any day.
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Old 08-01-2013, 01:11 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by CSG Mike View Post
I was thinking of linking that... but a lot of it is gonna be mumbo jumbo... hell, a lot of it is still mumbo jumbo to me.
There's a lot of that, but it's still fun.

- Andy
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:00 PM   #20
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If a competitor was going to copy shock damping they could just buy a KW or Ohlins on ebay and put it on a shock dyno. I dont' think that is the reason why companies dont release shock dynos.

Some companies don't like to show shock dynos because it may or may not be good publicity. Their marketing department may be saying one thing but their shock internals say something completely different. Customer don't understand for example why KW has digressive compression and linear rebound. Is it good or bad?

I have a shock dyno in my garage at home. It's amazing how much BS you discover when you put a shock on the dyno. What I have discovered is the quality of the valving is application dependent. A company can have a great suspension for one model and completely miss the mark on another car.

The other thing about suspension is you have to buy the one for your purpose. Are you daily driving or is this a full on profession race car. It's amazing to see the difference in spring rates between some manufacturers markets as street suspension.
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:04 PM   #21
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:13 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silversprint View Post
If a competitor was going to copy shock damping they could just buy a KW or Ohlins on ebay and put it on a shock dyno. I dont' think that is the reason why companies dont release shock dynos.

Some companies don't like to show shock dynos because it may or may not be good publicity. Their marketing department may be saying one thing but their shock internals say something completely different. Customer don't understand for example why KW has digressive compression and linear rebound. Is it good or bad?

I have a shock dyno in my garage at home. It's amazing how much BS you discover when you put a shock on the dyno. What I have discovered is the quality of the valving is application dependent. A company can have a great suspension for one model and completely miss the mark on another car.

The other thing about suspension is you have to buy the one for your purpose. Are you daily driving or is this a full on profession race car. It's amazing to see the difference in spring rates between some manufacturers markets as street suspension.
I do agree that this is a possible reason as well. Behind the scenes we've heard different explanations from different manufacturers and that has been one of them. With as complicated a topic as it is sometimes you can't blame them, but I am in the more info is more better camp.

- Andy
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Old 08-28-2013, 11:55 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Racecomp Engineering View Post
Also, I highly recommend reading the Penske shock manual. It is awesome information.

Here:
http://www.penskeshocks.com/files/Adjustable_Manual.pdf

Awesome explanation of what is happening inside a (very good) shock for compression and rebound. Also some damper tuning tips. Read it and love it. And remember not all shocks are like that inside, but it's still awesome to read.

- Andy

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