Has anyone had a warranty claim denied? Seized engine! Pics of teardown added 6/5

[vtmike]

Some of the noises that people are identifying as knock may be drive train noises. I can make the car produce a clank by shifting quickly and getting on the throttle before fully releasing the clutch. But, I can also make it do it by doing an upshift and abruptly releasing the clutch giving it no gas. When pulling in my garage I can get it to produce a similar noise by just feathering the clutch with no throttle letting the car rock forward and back.

Have you gotten any logs showing knock while doing a quick low rpm shift?

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[FirestormFRS]

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

Those 'top USA tuners' killed more tracked STIs than a stupid factory logic ever could, especially early in the development. There's very little that the tuners know about the new engines, sure, some of them can crack and dis-assemble the ECU code. But they know next to nothing about the actual combustion, it's sensitivity to temps/pressures/etc. It takes a lot of computational hours to work-out a good tune for a boosted DI engine.
They can learn that some things are not to be messed with, but they can only do this by watching knock (that is damaging your engines)/blown engines (your engines)/other damage. So, I find laughable the whole idea that some "pro tuner" w/o an advanced engineering degree and an all-round thorough understanding of exactly how modern engines work could magically come and fix the "horrible" factory tune. There are people like that who can properly come up with a tune that alters the tune per specifically requested trade-off on efficiency/emissions/reliability/performance relative to OEM, but they are:
a) employed by OEMs
b) will require long hours of computations on large computers.

I would not even trust aftermarket tuners to 'fix' just this one table. Doing so risks discovering at a later point that at the time the tuners didn't know about some other interlinked tables that got screwed up because of a 'fix'.

Someone who has a pretty firm grip on the reality of the modern engine control units.

[Sellout]

Originally Posted by Sportsguy83

That is not entirely true. You need to shift at high RPM to be above 5200 RPM in the next shift.

That is the "tip in knock issue" and the OEM ECU flash having that table disabled above 5200 RPMs.

Unless, of course, the Subaru tune is not quite the perfect tune some people like to say it is. Inducing knock in this car is disturbingly easy. Not getting the rpms high enough when pulling away from a stop on an incline induces knock. The last time I had to deal with that, I was driving something with a carburetor.

[Rampage]

Originally Posted by vtmike

Some of the noises that people are identifying as knock may be drive train noises. I can make the car produce a clank by shifting quickly and getting on the throttle before fully releasing the clutch. But, I can also make it do it by doing an upshift and abruptly releasing the clutch giving it no gas. When pulling in my garage I can get it to produce a similar noise by just feathering the clutch with no throttle letting the car rock forward and back.

Have you gotten any logs showing knock while doing a quick low rpm shift?

What you are probably hearing is slop in your drive shaft or CV joints. Watch the CV joints. If you start getting ticking from the area of the rear end then you will likely soon have a broken axle to contend with. This seems to be more and more common on lowered cars.

[sierra]

Originally Posted by Sellout

Unless, of course, the Subaru tune is not quite the perfect tune some people like to say it is. Inducing knock in this car is disturbingly easy. Not getting the rpms high enough when pulling away from a stop on an incline induces knock. The last time I had to deal with that, I was driving something with a carburetor.

Are you using the 93+ octane it's designed for or the 91 octane it can run on as a compromise?

[Sellout]

Originally Posted by sierra

Are you using the 93+ octane it's designed for or the 91 octane it can run on as a compromise?

I'm in Cali, there is no 93 here. I'm sure that's it.

[vtmike]

Originally Posted by Rampage

What you are probably hearing is slop in your drive shaft or CV joints. Watch the CV joints. If you start getting ticking from the area of the rear end then you will likely soon have a broken axle to contend with. This seems to be more and more common on lowered cars.

Mine sounds like it's from the front so I'm guessing drive shaft slop. Seems to be somewhat common. I'm thinking some people might be mistaking this for knocking in some cases.

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[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by sierra

Are you using the 93+ octane it's designed for or the 91 octane it can run on as a compromise?

Out here in California, we only have 91 octane that is adulterated with Ethanol...

[sierra]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Out here in California, we only have 91 octane that is adulterated with Ethanol...

The least they should do is tweak the ECU to suit that fuel and optimise the performance to compensate.

[NYCsubaruBRZ]

Originally Posted by Mikem53

What? Please explain how an exhaust system is going to cause engine failure? Nobody should fear warranty issues from a catback exhaust.. Except for the exhaust itself.

they will deny your warranty for any reason they can find. dont give them a reason. this car is full of the first year bugs and they dont want to pay or make recalls

[regal]

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

Those 'top USA tuners' killed more tracked STIs than a stupid factory logic ever could, especially early in the development. There's very little that the tuners know about the new engines, sure, some of them can crack and dis-assemble the ECU code. But they know next to nothing about the actual combustion, it's sensitivity to temps/pressures/etc. It takes a lot of computational hours to work-out a good tune for a boosted DI engine.
They can learn that some things are not to be messed with, but they can only do this by watching knock (that is damaging your engines)/blown engines (your engines)/other damage. So, I find laughable the whole idea that some "pro tuner" w/o an advanced engineering degree and an all-round thorough understanding of exactly how modern engines work could magically come and fix the "horrible" factory tune. There are people like that who can properly come up with a tune that alters the tune per specifically requested trade-off on efficiency/emissions/reliability/performance relative to OEM, but they are:
a) employed by OEMs
b) will require long hours of computations on large computers.

I would not even trust aftermarket tuners to 'fix' just this one table. Doing so risks discovering at a later point that at the time the tuners didn't know about some other interlinked tables that got screwed up because of a 'fix'.

Originally Posted by FirestormFRS

Someone who has a pretty firm grip on the reality of the modern engine control units.

Interesting, two opinions that we are dealing with rocket science. This isn't Star Trek 9, a factory tune is as much a product of corporate politics, sales marketing pressures, and regulatory requirements than your science fiction novel fantasies of solid engineering.

An independent experienced tuner can cut thru all thru crap.

Or we can keep waiting on the Toyota/Dealers to do something, going on a year since Mike's first engine was sent to the lab for analysis.

After changing the seals no way I would trust the local dealership here to do that job right, best warranty is the one never used.

[dsgerbc]

Originally Posted by regal

An independent experienced tuner can cut thru all thru crap.

99% of 'independent tuners' are grossly unqualified to tell crap apart from necessary code.

[regal]

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

99% of 'independent tuners' are grossly unqualified to tell crap apart from necessary code.

Agree fully.

When are we geting the TIR flash fix from Toyota ?

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by dsgerbc

Those 'top USA tuners' killed more tracked STIs than a stupid factory logic ever could, especially early in the development. There's very little that the tuners know about the new engines, sure, some of them can crack and dis-assemble the ECU code. But they know next to nothing about the actual combustion, it's sensitivity to temps/pressures/etc. It takes a lot of computational hours to work-out a good tune for a boosted DI engine.
They can learn that some things are not to be messed with, but they can only do this by watching knock (that is damaging your engines)/blown engines (your engines)/other damage. So, I find laughable the whole idea that some "pro tuner" w/o an advanced engineering degree and an all-round thorough understanding of exactly how modern engines work could magically come and fix the "horrible" factory tune. There are people like that who can properly come up with a tune that alters the tune per specifically requested trade-off on efficiency/emissions/reliability/performance relative to OEM, but they are:
a) employed by OEMs
b) will require long hours of computations on large computers.

I would not even trust aftermarket tuners to 'fix' just this one table. Doing so risks discovering at a later point that at the time the tuners didn't know about some other interlinked tables that got screwed up because of a 'fix'.

I'm not sure who you consider a "top tuner", but what I CAN tell you, is that the few tuners I personally trust work privately because they make far more money servicing the aftermarket than they would make at an OEM or a race team.

My tuners' understanding of combustion and engines is FAR more advanced than your average enthusiast; most of them also have advanced degrees as well.

They also wouldn't have the large client base that they have if they were regularly blowing up engines.