motor trend: next WRX based on ft86

[f1ver]

hey, i've been gone for a little bit, but have you guys seen this?
subaru saying that the next WRX will be based on the ft86 platform, and could have a monster engine + AWD
!!!! yeah!!!!!
=D


http://www.motortrend.com/future/fut...way/index.html

[OldSkoolToys]

270-300hp out of a 1.6L....reliably? with warranty? Lasting a few hundred-thousand miles with proper care?

They have to have that engine size wrong in that article. I know tech has come a long way, but thats near impossible out of a 1.6L with today's emission/MPG government regulations, as well as making sure it'll last longer than a 20k mile powertrain warranty.

Otherwise this article doesn't really tell us anything new. We already knew that the WRX and Impreza were parting ways. I added months ago it was probably to allow the Impreza to be the car IT'S supposed to be, same with the WRX. A few people were just saying "nah, just separating the name." Bogus, the Impreza has been holding back the WRX from its true potential, while the WRX has been keeping production costs up on the Impreza for years now.

[RRnold]

yeah, it was posted a while back.

http://www.ft86club.com/forums/showt...ght=Motortrend

[f1ver]

ah lol... i kinda figured! you guys are always pretty johnny on the spot with the news for sure... haha

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

270-300hp out of a 1.6L....reliably? with warranty? Lasting a few hundred-thousand miles with proper care?

They have to have that engine size wrong in that article. I know tech has come a long way, but thats near impossible out of a 1.6L with today's emission/MPG government regulations, as well as making sure it'll last longer than a 20k mile powertrain warranty.

Otherwise this article doesn't really tell us anything new. We already knew that the WRX and Impreza were parting ways. I added months ago it was probably to allow the Impreza to be the car IT'S supposed to be, same with the WRX. A few people were just saying "nah, just separating the name." Bogus, the Impreza has been holding back the WRX from its true potential, while the WRX has been keeping production costs up on the Impreza for years now.

If Subaru is going back to WRC then the 1.6L makes sense.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by tranzformer

If Subaru is going back to WRC then the 1.6L makes sense.

But not that HP stock. 200~240 is pushing government requirement MPG & etc I would say...

[tranzformer]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

But not that HP stock. 200~240 is pushing government requirement MPG & etc I would say...

Yeah 270 might be hard from a 1.6. But they could do it. Just will cost $$. If they dropped 300-400lbs, 240hp would be fun.

[PAImportTuner]

For all you naysayers yes it is very very possible for 280-300hp out of a 1.6L direct injection turbo car.

My Mini Cooper S is a 1.6L it makes 208hp/190tq, horsepower cuts out at 5600rpm and torque peaks at 1500rpm. Give the WRX a slightly larger twin-scroll turbo and it's easily achievable to make that to the crank, especially with direct injection and dual avcs. It's nothing new.

Remember the 2.0 STI in JPN can put down 300s to the wheels on stock turbo, that's with old tech EJ motors with no direct injection too.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

For all you naysayers yes it is very very possible for 280-300hp out of a 1.6L direct injection turbo car.

My Mini Cooper S is a 1.6L it makes 208hp/190tq, horsepower cuts out at 5600rpm and torque peaks at 1500rpm. Give the WRX a slightly larger twin-scroll turbo and it's easily achievable to make that to the crank, especially with direct injection and dual avcs. It's nothing new.

Remember the 2.0 STI in JPN can put down 300s to the wheels on stock turbo, that's with old tech EJ motors with no direct injection too.

K then give me the list of cars that have 1.6L w 280~300hp stock w price tag.

[PAImportTuner]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

K then give me the list of cars that have 1.6L w 280~300hp stock w price tag.

You're implying that to achieve 280-300hp on a 1.6L Turbo is very hard, well it's not. Subaru will already save a lot of money using the chassis they built for the FT and then modifying it for use with this car, that will go into engine dynamics. Go on Mini forums and see how many are putting down 220whp(est. 260hp to the motor, which is what the msrp sticker would list) with stock ko3 turbo, intake, exhaust and flash. Also just by using a vf34 or ko4(jcw) you can attain 240+whp(est. 290-300hp) without sacrificing low end due to the DI tuning and twin-scroll technology.

So with that said for $25WRX or 35kSTI starting, yes it is VERY possible for the new WRX and/or STI to put that down. From a financial and engineering perspective it can happen.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

You're implying that to achieve 280-300hp on a 1.6L Turbo is very hard, well it's not. Subaru will already save a lot of money using the chassis they built for the FT and then modifying it for use with this car, that will go into engine dynamics. Go on Mini forums and see how many are putting down 220whp(est. 260hp to the motor, which is what the msrp sticker would list) with stock ko3 turbo, intake, exhaust and flash. Also just by using a vf34 or ko4(jcw) you can attain 240+whp(est. 290-300hp) without sacrificing low end due to the DI tuning and twin-scroll technology.

So with that said for $25WRX or 35kSTI starting, yes it is VERY possible for the new WRX and/or STI to put that down. From a financial and engineering perspective it can happen.

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

Let me also add that's the point of this car and 1.6L, DI, AVCS, turbo engine tuning. To meet with future emissions guidelines, and possibly WRC competition. There isn't an existing car like this made as of yet from the factory, but you can also say there isn't a car like the FT86 made yet either, but soon will be.

So your argument makes no sense. Let me ask you what other production car out there is 2+2, 200hp, RWD and ~2700# and less than $25k??? Oh that's right, there are none currently in the past 10 years, if ever. I guess it's not possible or something is able to even exist. Nice try Utah boy.

You're not getting my point. Of course STI team can make 300hp w 1.6L engine for WRC. If that was the case, why in the fuck other STi/STI didn't never came w 500~600tq stock huh? They loose $ if they do those kind of moron stuff. Tuning it, yes it is possible. Stock, that'll NEVER happening

Even IF they do use FRS chassis, they have to redesign it anyways. In the end, it'll still cost them.

Again, what Utah gotta do w anything? I don't care you post where I live, but it's pointless.

[chulooz]

Yeah I agree with ichi on this, there is no way subaru is going to make those specs for their production cars, can they? Hell yeah, but there is little chance that they would ever consider such a wild motor... for now.

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

You're implying that to achieve 280-300hp on a 1.6L Turbo is very hard, well it's not. Subaru will already save a lot of money using the chassis they built for the FT and then modifying it for use with this car, that will go into engine dynamics. Go on Mini forums and see how many are putting down 220whp(est. 260hp to the motor, which is what the msrp sticker would list) with stock ko3 turbo, intake, exhaust and flash. Also just by using a vf34 or ko4(jcw) you can attain 240+whp(est. 290-300hp) without sacrificing low end due to the DI tuning and twin-scroll technology.

So with that said for $25WRX or 35kSTI starting, yes it is VERY possible for the new WRX and/or STI to put that down. From a financial and engineering perspective it can happen.

None of us ever said you couldn't make those numbers from a 1.6L turbo, and it certainly wouldn't be hard for the STI team to do so....we said they couldn't do it while maintaining emission and MPG standards, as well as the car having any form of noticeable powertrain warranty, etc. There's a difference between the official company WRC car, and putting something out on the dealers lots that they can actually sell respectively. For instance, in California, it doesn't do much good to spend $40k (thats after taxes, fees, etc.) on a brand new car that can't pass inspection...now does it?

The article doesn't do a good job of discerning what car they're talking about when it comes to that 300hp figure. The WRC car? Or the STI that's coming to the dealer lots? 250hp max I'd say for the stock STI, and thats only to keep the car respectable for the streets.

Also, your hp figures on the Mini....you don't lose 40hp in powertrain loss on a fronter. I'd estimate that 220whp figures out to 230hp to the flywheel. Hell even if the cooper were RWD...that's a tiny ass powertrain, still wouldn't lose 40hp.

[Dimman]

I think 300 hp is the technical limit the WRC tries to impose with restrictors and what-not. They would likely make the production version just powerful enough to be a tiny bit faster in a straight line than the outgoing model.

And much like the FT86, picking that HP number comes down to knowing the weight of the vehicle. Ugh...