all motor any chance? - Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community

EJ20 · 01-16-2015, 10:36 PM

Seeing so much development in forced induction section. Any know where the all motor tunning going or see/hear about anything?
Im a big fan for sub 2.0L high end all motors in a light weight cars. We all have seen +200hp 4age, and some crazy +300hp all motor 3sge beams engine. But why nothing yet for the fa20???? Yes I know its not cost effictive as going turbocharged but I know some want to take this route too

Sorry if this was discussed before but I just hope someone know something or news?

aznatama · 01-16-2015, 10:56 PM

Perhaps nobody has wanted to throw money at a project like this yet, or there's no reason for high investment in this field yet?

Dimman · 01-16-2015, 11:01 PM

Because it's hard and expensive.

phobos512 · 01-16-2015, 11:26 PM

Well let's see, there are cams now, and strokers and different pistons; not to mention exhaust setups out the wazoo...what more do you want? I don't recall seeing different heads or bored out cylinders yet though.

Quentin · 01-17-2015, 12:59 PM

I'd love to see a real all motor build. 10k redline with a snarl. Basically the FR-S I have on Forza.

Sent from Tandy 400

nguyen_er · 01-17-2015, 01:20 PM

I've wanted to do this too. Really not cost effective. But it would be so fun to have like 260whp all motor. Raise the FD to 4.56 or 4.88. Try to shed a 100 or 200 lbs. car would be beast.

phobos512 · 01-17-2015, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nguyen_er

I've wanted to do this too. Really not cost effective. But it would be so fun to have like 260whp all motor. Raise the FD to 4.56 or 4.88. Try to shed a 100 or 200 lbs. car would be beast.

That amount of weight loss is a cakewalk. 25 lbs for spare, 25 pounds for stock muffler, 23 pounds for seat delete, 26 pounds for battery, 4 pounds for crank pulley, 10 pounds for flywheel, 12 pounds for driveshaft, 10 pounds for a header, 10 pounds for overpipe and frontpipe. Starts to get more complicated from there though. 25 pounds for front brakes, maybe 40 pounds for wheels...$$$. @Anthony has done all the legwork already though.

Element Tuning is over 9000rpm on their turbo motor so it's certainly doable.

Tgionet · 01-17-2015, 07:13 PM

Element Tuning is also selling a 9000 RPM 13.5 CR built NA race motor. They don't make any power claims on it though

nguyen_er · 01-17-2015, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phobos512

That amount of weight loss is a cakewalk. 25 lbs for spare, 25 pounds for stock muffler, 23 pounds for seat delete, 26 pounds for battery, 4 pounds for crank pulley, 10 pounds for flywheel, 12 pounds for driveshaft, 10 pounds for a header, 10 pounds for overpipe and frontpipe. Starts to get more complicated from there though. 25 pounds for front brakes, maybe 40 pounds for wheels...$$$. @Anthony has done all the legwork already though.

Element Tuning is over 9000rpm on their turbo motor so it's certainly doable.

Guess that doesn't sound too terrible. Hmm wonder how much power you could get out of NA. What else would you have to do? Exhaust, intake maybe ITB? Rework the heads? Increase valve springs? Tuning. Forged internals. Can't forget those. Haha

Grip Ronin · 01-17-2015, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nguyen_er

Guess that doesn't sound too terrible. Hmm wonder how much power you could get out of NA. What else would you have to do? Exhaust, intake maybe ITB? Rework the heads? Increase valve springs? Tuning. Forged internals. Can't forget those. Haha

switch to different air sensors since they read maf and map and ITBs have neither unless you run a box over them which kinda defeats the point of them being individual

MrSlay · 01-18-2015, 01:37 PM

I really wouldn't compare Toyota to Subaru when it engines. Subaru may be a cool brand, but ive never seen a Subaru engine that is worth a second glance. My FA20 should make 250-270hp NA, but thats pretty much as far as im going to push the motor for what im building it for.

Anthony · 01-18-2015, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nguyen_er

...260whp all motor. Raise the FD to 4.56 or 4.88.

This is exactly my plan. I don't know about the 260whp, but definitely as much as possible.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phobos512

@Anthony has done all the legwork already though.

And still going! Should be sub 2,400lbs very soon.

nguyen_er · 01-18-2015, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony

This is exactly my plan. I don't know about the 260whp, but definitely as much as possible.

And still going! Should be sub 2,400lbs very soon.

Awesome! Gotta follow your build. Haha

themadscientist · 01-19-2015, 06:14 AM

The bang for the buck factor is terrible. Why do all that for so little return on your investment? Except for some sort of spec race series or just to prove some sort of point, it doesn't make sense when you can strap a turbo or supercharger on it and easily eclipse the power of a fully built NA engine costing twice as much.

01-16-2015, 10:36 PM	#1
EJ20 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Drives: NA8C, GDB, and R50 Location: Qatar Posts: 310 Thanks: 17 Thanked 15 Times in 12 Posts Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	all motor any chance? Seeing so much development in forced induction section. Any know where the all motor tunning going or see/hear about anything? Im a big fan for sub 2.0L high end all motors in a light weight cars. We all have seen +200hp 4age, and some crazy +300hp all motor 3sge beams engine. But why nothing yet for the fa20???? Yes I know its not cost effictive as going turbocharged but I know some want to take this route too Sorry if this was discussed before but I just hope someone know something or news? __________________ See My Album: http://www.ft86club.com/forums/album.php?u=949

01-16-2015, 10:56 PM	#2
aznatama Senior Member Join Date: May 2014 Drives: 2014 BRZ MT (Sold); 2006 V70R Location: Fairfax Posts: 873 Thanks: 10 Thanked 186 Times in 150 Posts Mentioned: 8 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Perhaps nobody has wanted to throw money at a project like this yet, or there's no reason for high investment in this field yet? __________________ '14 BRZ LTD MT DGM

01-16-2015, 11:26 PM	#4
phobos512 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Drives: 2014 FR-S 6MT Whiteout Location: Southern Maryland Posts: 950 Thanks: 234 Thanked 374 Times in 260 Posts Mentioned: 9 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	Well let's see, there are cams now, and strokers and different pistons; not to mention exhaust setups out the wazoo...what more do you want? I don't recall seeing different heads or bored out cylinders yet though. __________________ Matt \| '14 FR-S 6MT Whiteout \| '13 Sonata Hybrid \| '11 CBR1000RR

01-18-2015, 01:37 PM	#11
MrSlay Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Drives: Gx 460, FRS, Prius Location: Aventura FL Posts: 96 Thanks: 27 Thanked 29 Times in 20 Posts Mentioned: 3 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I really wouldn't compare Toyota to Subaru when it engines. Subaru may be a cool brand, but ive never seen a Subaru engine that is worth a second glance. My FA20 should make 250-270hp NA, but thats pretty much as far as im going to push the motor for what im building it for. __________________ 15 FRS 12 Prius 12 ISF 15 Gx 460 My YouTube Channel

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01-17-2015, 12:59 PM	#5
Quentin Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2011 Drives: ‘16 4Runner, ‘19 Corolla HB Location: Hurricane, WV Posts: 1,233 Thanks: 685 Thanked 813 Times in 435 Posts Mentioned: 4 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I'd love to see a real all motor build. 10k redline with a snarl. Basically the FR-S I have on Forza. Sent from Tandy 400

01-17-2015, 01:20 PM	#6
nguyen_er Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Drives: 2013 Raven FR-S Location: Wichita, KS Posts: 510 Thanks: 101 Thanked 83 Times in 69 Posts Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	I've wanted to do this too. Really not cost effective. But it would be so fun to have like 260whp all motor. Raise the FD to 4.56 or 4.88. Try to shed a 100 or 200 lbs. car would be beast.

01-19-2015, 06:14 AM	#14
themadscientist Hotlink Terrorist Join Date: Nov 2014 Drives: 2015 WRB BRZ Spec S Location: "Dirty South" Japan Posts: 2,077 Thanks: 1,525 Thanked 2,624 Times in 1,196 Posts Mentioned: 12 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s)	The bang for the buck factor is terrible. Why do all that for so little return on your investment? Except for some sort of spec race series or just to prove some sort of point, it doesn't make sense when you can strap a turbo or supercharger on it and easily eclipse the power of a fully built NA engine costing twice as much.

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