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Old 11-21-2019, 02:45 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
I think you guys are creating more of a problem than what exists. The car meets the needs of the masses, but not everyone. No one is claiming anything different.

The average person drives 30 miles a day:

https://newsroom.aaa.com/2015/04/new...torists-drive/

The time to recharge that 30 miles on a V3 Supercharger is around 3 minutes. Faster than most people spend in line at Starbucks every morning.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mot...er-tested/amp/

If someone doesnít want to install a 240v outlet then the 120v will add 3-5 miles of range per hour, which is 8-10 hours of charging for 30 miles. A 240v socket like that of a dryer or stove from an older home will add 22 miles of range per hour, so it would take 1.5 hours to add 30 miles. Again, for the vast majority of people, this meets their daily needs.

https://teslatap.com/articles/tesla-...harging-guide/
I can add nothing intelligent to this conversation since I am clueless on EVs but it would seem that this would indeed work fine for the vast majority of the population. That would work for my wife except that we use her car for all our road trips and I would think charging would be a nightmare for planning since most of our trips consist of "that road looks cool wonder where it goes?"
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Old 11-21-2019, 03:01 PM   #86
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Yeah electric cars are fine if you live and work in the same town.

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At 240v (old homes version), if you plugged in the car from 10pm to 6am every night then you could add 176 miles per night. At 70 miles per hour, that is 2.5 hours of highway driving per day. That doesnít cover everyone, but it covers the vast majority of daily users and long commuters. The standard for most Tesla owners is the 50 amp (RV-style) outlet, which adds 30 miles of range per hour or 240 miles per 8 hours or almost 3.5 hours of highway driving range per day.

It probably doesnít work for people who drive for a living all day long.
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Old 11-21-2019, 03:06 PM   #87
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At 240v (old homes version), if you plugged in the car from 10pm to 6am every night then you could add 176 miles per night. At 70 miles per hour, that is 2.5 hours of highway driving per day. That doesnít cover everyone, but it covers the vast majority of daily users and long commuters. The standard for most Tesla owners is the 50 amp (RV-style) outlet, which adds 30 miles of range per hour or 240 miles per 8 hours or almost 3.5 hours of highway driving range per day.



It probably doesnít work for people who drive for a living all day long.
Haha yeah not quite for me. I have to drive like 1.5-2hrs each way. My next car might have hybrid tech, but I doubt I could go full electric unless batteries get better.

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Old 11-21-2019, 03:33 PM   #88
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I think you guys are creating more of a problem than what exists. The car meets the needs of the masses, but not everyone. No one is claiming anything different.
I think you're assuming the person either 1) never leaves town or 2) if they do they either have another car or takes mass transportation.

I have plenty of family members that have one "do everything" car. Every year, every one of them take plenty of trips that would require them to refuel on the go. Their single car needs to meet that need without being "a burden".

Like anything else, it's the last 10% of use cases that require 90% of the work to resolve.
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Old 11-21-2019, 03:37 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
I think you guys are creating more of a problem than what exists. The car meets the needs of the masses, but not everyone. No one is claiming anything different.

The average person drives 30 miles a day:

https://newsroom.aaa.com/2015/04/new...torists-drive/

The time to recharge that 30 miles on a V3 Supercharger is around 3 minutes. Faster than most people spend in line at Starbucks every morning.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mot...er-tested/amp/

If someone doesnít want to install a 240v outlet then the 120v will add 3-5 miles of range per hour, which is 8-10 hours of charging for 30 miles. A 240v socket like that of a dryer or stove from an older home will add 22 miles of range per hour, so it would take 1.5 hours to add 30 miles. Again, for the vast majority of people, this meets their daily needs.

https://teslatap.com/articles/tesla-...harging-guide/
So why do EVs need to lug around 200+ mile battery packs again? Seems like 50-100 mile packs would work out fine and be more efficient in the long run.
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Old 11-21-2019, 03:47 PM   #90
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Haha yeah not quite for me. I have to drive like 1.5-2hrs each way. My next car might have hybrid tech, but I doubt I could go full electric unless batteries get better.

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That sucks.
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Old 11-21-2019, 03:55 PM   #91
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That sucks.
Yes, yes it does. I live in the middle of CT and I have to drive White Plains, NY for most of my jet trips. Only good news is often times I'm gone for days. They don't have EV charging stations on the private side of the airport though. BRZ is a great car for me though because it's highly maneuverable and NYC traffic is free-for-all, lol.

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Old 11-21-2019, 03:58 PM   #92
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I think you're assuming the person either 1) never leaves town or 2) if they do they either have another car or takes mass transportation.

I have plenty of family members that have one "do everything" car. Every year, every one of them take plenty of trips that would require them to refuel on the go. Their single car needs to meet that need without being "a burden".

Like anything else, it's the last 10% of use cases that require 90% of the work to resolve.
There are chargers and Superchargers for trips, or yes, someone could use someone else's car if that didnít meet their needs. We are a two car family, but my uncle, as an example, has three teenage kids, so they are a five car family, so someone could own the gas car, and the rest could own electric. We borrowed my dadís truck to go to the snow before we got the Q5. The BRZ doesnít work for Home Depot trips or for camping or for Tahoe trips. Similarly, current electric might not meet the needs of everyone and for every situation. If vehicles needed to be everything then the Miata or BRZ wouldnít exist. Again, no one is claiming the EV would be perfect in every situation or the most convenient in every situation.
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Old 11-21-2019, 03:59 PM   #93
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Yes, yes it does. I live in the middle of CT and I have to drive White Plains, NY for most of my jet trips. Only good news is often times I'm gone for days. They don't have EV charging stations on the private side of the airport though. BRZ is a great car for me though because it's highly maneuverable and NYC traffic is free-for-all, lol.

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Old 11-21-2019, 04:10 PM   #94
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So why do EVs need to lug around 200+ mile battery packs again? Seems like 50-100 mile packs would work out fine and be more efficient in the long run.
The GM EV1 had 60 miles of range. It worked as a primary vehicle or secondary household vehicle quite well for its owners.

The larger batteries provide more range to reduce range anxiety and to be there when owners need more range, and they help with performance. They probably help with recharging speeds too.
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Old 11-21-2019, 04:14 PM   #95
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Old 11-21-2019, 04:17 PM   #96
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There are chargers and Superchargers for trips, or yes, someone could use someone else's car if that didnít meet their needs. ...
Chargers and Superchargers for trips longer than the range of the car are a serious compromise now. They will be less so over time, and eventually may not be one at all. That's a long way down the electric highway though.

You and I are talking circles around the same argument, but in general we agree. EVs work for some, work with compromise for others, and for some its not an answer to anything at all.

There are EV-Nuts though that think everyone that isn't buying an EV right now are just being stupid and want to kill the planet. EVs, with existing battery tech, will never be as ubiquitous as ICE however.
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Old 11-21-2019, 04:21 PM   #97
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So why do EVs need to lug around 200+ mile battery packs again? Seems like 50-100 mile packs would work out fine and be more efficient in the long run.
Range anxiety mostly. I have an 80 mile a day round trip commute. I would not do it in a car that did not have at least a 160 mile range, assuming I couldn't plug in at work. If I had a 20 mile round trip commute every day I would do it in a 50 mile range car, but what percentage of the population really have a 10 mile or less drive to work?
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Old 11-21-2019, 04:22 PM   #98
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It looks much better with the blacked out grill.
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