follow ft86club on our blog, twitter or facebook.
FT86CLUB
Ft86Club
Delicious Tuning
Register Garage Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   Toyota GR86, 86, FR-S and Subaru BRZ Forum & Owners Community - FT86CLUB > Off-Topic Discussions > Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions

Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions Discuss all other cars and automotive news here.


User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-21-2019, 01:45 PM   #85
Tcoat
Senior Member
 
Tcoat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Drives: 2020 Hakone
Location: London, Ont
Posts: 69,845
Thanks: 61,656
Thanked 108,283 Times in 46,456 Posts
Mentioned: 2494 Post(s)
Tagged: 50 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
I think you guys are creating more of a problem than what exists. The car meets the needs of the masses, but not everyone. No one is claiming anything different.

The average person drives 30 miles a day:

https://newsroom.aaa.com/2015/04/new...torists-drive/

The time to recharge that 30 miles on a V3 Supercharger is around 3 minutes. Faster than most people spend in line at Starbucks every morning.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mot...er-tested/amp/

If someone doesn’t want to install a 240v outlet then the 120v will add 3-5 miles of range per hour, which is 8-10 hours of charging for 30 miles. A 240v socket like that of a dryer or stove from an older home will add 22 miles of range per hour, so it would take 1.5 hours to add 30 miles. Again, for the vast majority of people, this meets their daily needs.

https://teslatap.com/articles/tesla-...harging-guide/
I can add nothing intelligent to this conversation since I am clueless on EVs but it would seem that this would indeed work fine for the vast majority of the population. That would work for my wife except that we use her car for all our road trips and I would think charging would be a nightmare for planning since most of our trips consist of "that road looks cool wonder where it goes?"
__________________
Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar, because Racecar.
Tcoat is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tcoat For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (11-21-2019), Irace86.2.0 (11-21-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 02:01 PM   #86
Irace86.2.0
Senior Member
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,882
Thanks: 5,665
Thanked 5,802 Times in 3,297 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p1l0t View Post
Yeah electric cars are fine if you live and work in the same town.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
At 240v (old homes version), if you plugged in the car from 10pm to 6am every night then you could add 176 miles per night. At 70 miles per hour, that is 2.5 hours of highway driving per day. That doesn’t cover everyone, but it covers the vast majority of daily users and long commuters. The standard for most Tesla owners is the 50 amp (RV-style) outlet, which adds 30 miles of range per hour or 240 miles per 8 hours or almost 3.5 hours of highway driving range per day.

It probably doesn’t work for people who drive for a living all day long.
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2019, 02:06 PM   #87
p1l0t
Senior Member
 
p1l0t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Drives: 2016 Subaru BRZ Hyperblue
Location: West Hartford, CT
Posts: 8,416
Thanks: 22,575
Thanked 9,371 Times in 4,813 Posts
Mentioned: 58 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
At 240v (old homes version), if you plugged in the car from 10pm to 6am every night then you could add 176 miles per night. At 70 miles per hour, that is 2.5 hours of highway driving per day. That doesn’t cover everyone, but it covers the vast majority of daily users and long commuters. The standard for most Tesla owners is the 50 amp (RV-style) outlet, which adds 30 miles of range per hour or 240 miles per 8 hours or almost 3.5 hours of highway driving range per day.



It probably doesn’t work for people who drive for a living all day long.
Haha yeah not quite for me. I have to drive like 1.5-2hrs each way. My next car might have hybrid tech, but I doubt I could go full electric unless batteries get better.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
p1l0t is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to p1l0t For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (11-21-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 02:33 PM   #88
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,798
Thanks: 38,786
Thanked 24,907 Times in 11,362 Posts
Mentioned: 181 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
I think you guys are creating more of a problem than what exists. The car meets the needs of the masses, but not everyone. No one is claiming anything different.
I think you're assuming the person either 1) never leaves town or 2) if they do they either have another car or takes mass transportation.

I have plenty of family members that have one "do everything" car. Every year, every one of them take plenty of trips that would require them to refuel on the go. Their single car needs to meet that need without being "a burden".

Like anything else, it's the last 10% of use cases that require 90% of the work to resolve.
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
why? (11-23-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 02:37 PM   #89
Spuds
The Dictater
 
Spuds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Drives: '13 Red Scion FRS
Location: MD, USA
Posts: 9,399
Thanks: 26,057
Thanked 12,400 Times in 6,129 Posts
Mentioned: 85 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
I think you guys are creating more of a problem than what exists. The car meets the needs of the masses, but not everyone. No one is claiming anything different.

The average person drives 30 miles a day:

https://newsroom.aaa.com/2015/04/new...torists-drive/

The time to recharge that 30 miles on a V3 Supercharger is around 3 minutes. Faster than most people spend in line at Starbucks every morning.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mot...er-tested/amp/

If someone doesn’t want to install a 240v outlet then the 120v will add 3-5 miles of range per hour, which is 8-10 hours of charging for 30 miles. A 240v socket like that of a dryer or stove from an older home will add 22 miles of range per hour, so it would take 1.5 hours to add 30 miles. Again, for the vast majority of people, this meets their daily needs.

https://teslatap.com/articles/tesla-...harging-guide/
So why do EVs need to lug around 200+ mile battery packs again? Seems like 50-100 mile packs would work out fine and be more efficient in the long run.
Spuds is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Spuds For This Useful Post:
why? (11-23-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 02:47 PM   #90
Irace86.2.0
Senior Member
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,882
Thanks: 5,665
Thanked 5,802 Times in 3,297 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p1l0t View Post
Haha yeah not quite for me. I have to drive like 1.5-2hrs each way. My next car might have hybrid tech, but I doubt I could go full electric unless batteries get better.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
That sucks.
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post:
p1l0t (11-21-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 02:55 PM   #91
p1l0t
Senior Member
 
p1l0t's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Drives: 2016 Subaru BRZ Hyperblue
Location: West Hartford, CT
Posts: 8,416
Thanks: 22,575
Thanked 9,371 Times in 4,813 Posts
Mentioned: 58 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
That sucks.
Yes, yes it does. I live in the middle of CT and I have to drive White Plains, NY for most of my jet trips. Only good news is often times I'm gone for days. They don't have EV charging stations on the private side of the airport though. BRZ is a great car for me though because it's highly maneuverable and NYC traffic is free-for-all, lol.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
p1l0t is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2019, 02:58 PM   #92
Irace86.2.0
Senior Member
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,882
Thanks: 5,665
Thanked 5,802 Times in 3,297 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dadhawk View Post
I think you're assuming the person either 1) never leaves town or 2) if they do they either have another car or takes mass transportation.

I have plenty of family members that have one "do everything" car. Every year, every one of them take plenty of trips that would require them to refuel on the go. Their single car needs to meet that need without being "a burden".

Like anything else, it's the last 10% of use cases that require 90% of the work to resolve.
There are chargers and Superchargers for trips, or yes, someone could use someone else's car if that didn’t meet their needs. We are a two car family, but my uncle, as an example, has three teenage kids, so they are a five car family, so someone could own the gas car, and the rest could own electric. We borrowed my dad’s truck to go to the snow before we got the Q5. The BRZ doesn’t work for Home Depot trips or for camping or for Tahoe trips. Similarly, current electric might not meet the needs of everyone and for every situation. If vehicles needed to be everything then the Miata or BRZ wouldn’t exist. Again, no one is claiming the EV would be perfect in every situation or the most convenient in every situation.
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (11-21-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 02:59 PM   #93
Irace86.2.0
Senior Member
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,882
Thanks: 5,665
Thanked 5,802 Times in 3,297 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p1l0t View Post
Yes, yes it does. I live in the middle of CT and I have to drive White Plains, NY for most of my jet trips. Only good news is often times I'm gone for days. They don't have EV charging stations on the private side of the airport though. BRZ is a great car for me though because it's highly maneuverable and NYC traffic is free-for-all, lol.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Yes, at this time you are not an ideal candidate for an EV.
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Irace86.2.0 For This Useful Post:
p1l0t (11-21-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 03:10 PM   #94
Irace86.2.0
Senior Member
 
Irace86.2.0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Drives: Q5 + BRZ + M796
Location: Santa Rosa, CA
Posts: 7,882
Thanks: 5,665
Thanked 5,802 Times in 3,297 Posts
Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spuds View Post
So why do EVs need to lug around 200+ mile battery packs again? Seems like 50-100 mile packs would work out fine and be more efficient in the long run.
The GM EV1 had 60 miles of range. It worked as a primary vehicle or secondary household vehicle quite well for its owners.

The larger batteries provide more range to reduce range anxiety and to be there when owners need more range, and they help with performance. They probably help with recharging speeds too.
__________________
My Build | K24 Turbo Swap | *K24T BRZ SOLD*
Irace86.2.0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2019, 03:14 PM   #95
Tcoat
Senior Member
 
Tcoat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Drives: 2020 Hakone
Location: London, Ont
Posts: 69,845
Thanks: 61,656
Thanked 108,283 Times in 46,456 Posts
Mentioned: 2494 Post(s)
Tagged: 50 Thread(s)
__________________
Racecar spelled backwards is Racecar, because Racecar.
Tcoat is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Tcoat For This Useful Post:
Dadhawk (11-21-2019), Irace86.2.0 (11-21-2019), Spuds (11-21-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 03:17 PM   #96
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,798
Thanks: 38,786
Thanked 24,907 Times in 11,362 Posts
Mentioned: 181 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irace86.2.0 View Post
There are chargers and Superchargers for trips, or yes, someone could use someone else's car if that didn’t meet their needs. ...
Chargers and Superchargers for trips longer than the range of the car are a serious compromise now. They will be less so over time, and eventually may not be one at all. That's a long way down the electric highway though.

You and I are talking circles around the same argument, but in general we agree. EVs work for some, work with compromise for others, and for some its not an answer to anything at all.

There are EV-Nuts though that think everyone that isn't buying an EV right now are just being stupid and want to kill the planet. EVs, with existing battery tech, will never be as ubiquitous as ICE however.
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
Irace86.2.0 (11-21-2019), Spuds (11-21-2019), why? (11-23-2019)
Old 11-21-2019, 03:21 PM   #97
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,798
Thanks: 38,786
Thanked 24,907 Times in 11,362 Posts
Mentioned: 181 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spuds View Post
So why do EVs need to lug around 200+ mile battery packs again? Seems like 50-100 mile packs would work out fine and be more efficient in the long run.
Range anxiety mostly. I have an 80 mile a day round trip commute. I would not do it in a car that did not have at least a 160 mile range, assuming I couldn't plug in at work. If I had a 20 mile round trip commute every day I would do it in a 50 mile range car, but what percentage of the population really have a 10 mile or less drive to work?
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-21-2019, 03:22 PM   #98
Dadhawk
1st86 Driver!
 
Dadhawk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Drives: '13 FR-S (#3 of 1st 86)
Location: Powder Springs, GA
Posts: 19,798
Thanks: 38,786
Thanked 24,907 Times in 11,362 Posts
Mentioned: 181 Post(s)
Tagged: 4 Thread(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcoat View Post
It looks much better with the blacked out grill.
__________________

Visit my Owner's Journal where I wax philosophic on all things FR-S
Post your 86 or see others in front of a(n) (in)famous landmark.
What fits in your 86? Show us the "Junk In Your Trunk".
Dadhawk is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Dadhawk For This Useful Post:
p1l0t (11-21-2019)
 
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ford swap? crazyfrenchbiker Engine Swaps 60 01-31-2018 10:55 AM
My 225 whp 1990 ford fiesta aka the ford party Frog Other Vehicles & General Automotive Discussions 25 12-23-2015 01:13 PM
Take a look at the Ford FR-S.... Tromatic Scion FR-S / Toyota 86 GT86 General Forum 26 06-09-2013 03:40 PM
FRS/BRZ vs Ford Fiesta ST overlookedx FR-S / BRZ vs.... 32 02-28-2013 02:17 AM
What does FORD stand for? Lexicon101 Off-Topic Lounge [WARNING: NO POLITICS] 16 03-19-2010 09:48 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:12 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

Garage vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.