e85 Disappearing Act - NY Special

[brichard0625]

so i found a little calculator and used my highest 93 pump gas that i get now and the highest i got for e85. i called the gas stations around me and e85 is 3.65-3.69. one station said theres a shortage so thats why the price is high but it should go down when its gets a little warmer. lets hope hes right but according to the calculator its not that bad when comparing. if flexfuel nets me higher mpg then e85 will be a better choice. sorry if im typing all over the place, im at work and trying to get my point across fast so i can finish up.

[HunterGreene]

Originally Posted by 86viper

In the short term perhaps say 5 years, but In 10 years there won't be a choice. Petrol/Gasoline will be so expensive that the only alternatives will be biofuels or electric.

Once production of biofuels is at a level it should have been years ago the prices will stop going up quickly rising only with inlfation, while petrol/gasoline will rise fast.

The "experts" were saying the same thing 5-10 years ago, post-9/11 when gas and oil prices shot up because the speculation market went crazy and Big Oil took advantage. All I am saying is that speculating is only a guess. Nobody knows what the market is going to do in the future.

Now don't get me wrong, biofuels, fuel cells/electric are definitely where we are headed if we want to keep our lifestyle sustained at the level it is. But, lets face it, gas is still plentiful and the most recent estimates I've seen say that oil, thanks to new technologies that can drill and recover from places that were not originally available to mine, won't be at a scarcity well into this century, even with the possibility of extending supplies through 2100. But, like I said, we don't know where things will end up.

[SirBrass]

Originally Posted by evo4g63

E85 down here in Phoenix is $2.99/gal and has been for some time. Some weeks it goes down to $2.89/gal

Out shitty piss water CA 91 pump fuel is $3.68-$3.89/gal. It's a no brainier for us down here. Another factor is I do not trust the shitty grade 91 pump fuel we get. It's way to in-consistent.

QT pump gas is consistent, actually.

I WILL go flex-fuel eventually. When winter hits, e85 is no longer as economical, but for the summer and the massive watering down our gas gets plus the higher price for it, e85 just makes sense even if just good financial sense.

Originally Posted by HunterGreene

The "experts" were saying the same thing 5-10 years ago, post-9/11 when gas and oil prices shot up because the speculation market went crazy and Big Oil took advantage. All I am saying is that speculating is only a guess. Nobody knows what the market is going to do in the future.

Now don't get me wrong, biofuels, fuel cells/electric are definitely where we are headed if we want to keep our lifestyle sustained at the level it is. But, lets face it, gas is still plentiful and the most recent estimates I've seen say that oil, thanks to new technologies that can drill and recover from places that were not originally available to mine, won't be at a scarcity well into this century, even with the possibility of extending supplies through 2100. But, like I said, we don't know where things will end up.

Not to mention that the oil shortage "crisis" is 100% manufactured. The United States, not the Arab Penninsula, has the largest and most plentiful oil and natural gas reserves in the world. We are so far away from an actual shortage that it's laughable. If there's any actual shortage it's b/c of a the bottlenecking due to lack of refineries... something that you can partially lay the blame for at the feet of the eco-freaks.

[wparsons]

The crisis is just a way to drive prices up, and they have us all by the balls. As cars get more efficient they drive the price up higher so they're still making as much (or more) money.

As for prices, I pay about $1.45/L for premium here, I would LOVE US gas prices! $1.45/L is about $5.49 CDN per gallon, or about $4.96 USD per gallon.

[steve99]

Originally Posted by wparsons

The crisis is just a way to drive prices up, and they have us all by the balls. As cars get more efficient they drive the price up higher so they're still making as much (or more) money.

As for prices, I pay about $1.45/L for premium here, I would LOVE US gas prices! $1.45/L is about $5.49 CDN per gallon, or about $4.96 USD per gallon.

You USA/Canada guys don't know how good you have it

Oz E85 A$1.35 L times 3.8L/G = A$5.13 US Gal * 0.9 exchange = USD$4.61 US Gal

Oz 98/100 RON = A$1.65 L

[StormTrooper]

I don't see petroleum going away any time soon, but government is hard to predict.


Don't even have an e85 station in my town (60k pop) 45 miles to the nearest one.


Wish we had 95 or 100 Oct instead of 91 or e85.

[ZionsWrath]

lol I get less than 25 on 93, i guess i better put my foot on a diet...

[Superhatch]

The article mentioned multiple times the issue was "rail logistics" or "rail slowdowns" but didn't really get into detail what that issue really was about. I'd like to hear more on that because it seems like it might be due to all the rails being used for frac sand. I work for a company that does a lot of work with frac companies here in WI and they occupy a LOT of train cars daily, all cars that were used for something else prior to the frac boom. The increased traffic could be the reason we are seeing slower grain pickup. Just an idea.

Also, Ethanol is really expensive when you start to factor in all the subsidies that growers and producers get. "But those all expired!" you might say..

http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-dru...-little-better

Here is Aaron Smith, writing a couple of days ago for the conservative American Enterprise Institute:

Deficit hawks, environmentalists, and food processors are celebrating the expiration of the ethanol tax credit. This corporate handout gave $0.45 to ethanol producers for every gallon they produced and cost taxpayers $6 billion in 2011. So why did the powerful corn ethanol lobby let it expire without an apparent fight? The answer lies in legislation known as the Renewable Fuel Standard (RFS), which creates government-guaranteed demand that keeps corn prices high and generates massive farm profits. Removing the tax credit but keeping the RFS is like scraping a little frosting from the ethanol-boondoggle cake.

The RFS mandates that at least 37 percent of the 2011-12 corn crop be converted to ethanol and blended with the gasoline that powers our cars…[As a result] the current price of corn on the Chicago Mercantile Exchange is about $6.50 per bushel—almost triple the pre-mandate level.

Now this article, along with others (see below) really shows the big issue with turning corn into fuel. It's pretty expensive, it's really labor intensive, and most of the actual cost is hidden in your taxes. I love E85 for power, but it's not the future. For the -actual- cost, it's a terrible fuel when viewed from either a national or personal economic standpoint. If taxpayers are smart they would end these subsidies, start growing food, and concentrate on other fuels with better ROEI levels.

http://www.taxpayer.net/library/arti...alive-and-well
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/econom...anol-subsidies
http://theweek.com/article/index/247...nol-subsidiesb

Side note:It's not small farms that are reaping in all the profits. It large AG Business that owns and harvests most of the corn fields in the country. Cargill, ADM, Monsanto etc are getting the majority of your tax money to grow corn to turn into fuel. They then also run the ethanol producing companies which also get your tax money (my company does work for them too)! Yay!

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_farming"]Corporate farming - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

[jeebus]

I paid $4.23 for e85 yesterday.

[Luckrider]

So, as an update, I spent about an hour and a half trying to track down some e85. I burned a good 1/4 tank and was unsuccessful and had to fill with 93. I got 11.5 gallons in and the damn stuff cost me $46 bucks. I already miss the corn juice and its power. I'm pulling my last e85 log from a week ago as I type now. I must say, this is quite sad. 3 stations that usually carry told me they ran out and the next tank had their cost over $4/gallon.

[2point0]

Damn. The places by me don't even know what they charge for it, let alone what they'll sell the next batch for.

[Luckrider]

I was getting those withdrawl symptoms as the tank was getting empty and I would have paid $100 for my fix.

[Walla Walla]

i would be more than happy to pay 4$ a gallon of e85 (but we don't have it here) and to me, it sound's cheap since we payh 5.86$ our gallon of 91 oct...

[ProjectGT86]

Originally Posted by Luckrider

Well, it looks like I might be on my last tank of e85. I went to fill up tonight and the pumps were "Out of Service." I asked if they were to to find out when they were getting more and sure enough, they had plenty in the tanks, but they didn't think anyone would pay $3.60/gallon. They said the next order would cost $4/gallon and that they weren't buying.

Has anyone else heard of e85 price increases by them? This would really suck if this wonder fuel dried up because it is no longer economical for the average consumer who isn't interested in performance. They turned the pump on for me at $3.60/gallon, but I don't see them having any more by the time I need my next fix.

To the mods. I felt this was the best subforum for this thread since you need to tune to run the stuff. If any mod feels it needs to be moved, I understand.

Edit: I found a relevent article: http://in.reuters.com/article/2014/0...0ML1T120140324

The E85 Stations around western MA have their prices at around $4 per gallon, they seem to be doing fine though since Bren Tuning (which is in Western MA) has a lot of customers with their cars running on E85