Wheel Directory: Enkei RPF1 17x8.0 +35

[Deep Six]

Originally Posted by Dezoris

Well here is the thing plastic does nothing for holding the wheel on just helps center. Far from load bearing and high heat I would assume would melt them. You guys with aluminum rings you dont get any siezing or cracking of the rings? Have you actually tracked them under high brake temps?
@Mike csg
You run sprint and rpf1s with no rings and your own lugs no issues with wobble etc?

I used a set of aluminum rings for mounting track wheels to a C63. It was nearly 4,000 pounds and I used R6's and DTC70's so plenty of heat was generated. Never had a ring crack but they would stick to the hub when the wheels were removed. Not difficult to pop them off though.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by KONVERTER

Right... You don't have an issue until a wheel flies off...

I have seen it, and have dealt with the lawsuit...

Please explain with actual facts how a hub centric ring will keep a wheel from flying off...? Or how not using them will cause a wheel to fly off?

The only thing a hub centric ring does is keeps the wheel centered while you're tightening the lugs. The studs support the weight of the car, not the tiny little lip on the hub.

[Gary in NJ]

Originally Posted by wparsons

The only thing a hub centric ring does is keeps the wheel centered while you're tightening the lugs. The studs support the weight of the car, not the tiny little lip on the hub.

Ladies and gentlemen, we have a winner. Plastic or aluminum...doesn't matter. Plastic may crack and need to be replaced during a wheel change. Aluminum may get stuck which is no big deal.

[KONVERTER]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Please explain with actual facts how a hub centric ring will keep a wheel from flying off...? Or how not using them will cause a wheel to fly off?

The only thing a hub centric ring does is keeps the wheel centered while you're tightening the lugs. The studs support the weight of the car, not the tiny little lip on the hub.

In the event you hit a bump hard enough, and there is nothing keeping the wheel locked in place. The hub bolts will literally sheer off.

Picture this.

Two pieces of wood with a hole in it with a pencil in the hole. If you knock the top wood the pencil will snap. If you have a large metal tube going through both pieces of wood, it will absorb / keep the two pieces of wood from moving so much to break the pencil.

If you are ok with your entire wheel being supported by 5 little $2 bolts then that is up to you. Id rather my wheels held securely centered in place by the wheel hub, and bolted up with the hub bolts.

You have dowel pins on the transmission dont you? There are not just bolts holding it up to the block. Take out the dowel pins and only use bolts... Same kind of thing...

Plastic or Metal they do the job. The plastic is not going to crush under impact.... They are usually a very dense plastic that can not really be compressed.

[pche]

Use them! You must! No reason not to. They keep your wheels center on your hubs, hence "hub" centric! Wheels today are no longer "lug" centric. Hub rings are absolutely essential to proper wheel installation when you're using 73mm hub bore wheels on our 56mm hubs. Also you have to use taper lug nuts, or you risk damage your new wheels.

I've seen too many horror stories when people cheap out and don't use the right parts. Wheels coming off is no joke, especially if you're planning on using them in race applications.

ETA: DO NOT use your factory lug nuts on your RPF1s

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by KONVERTER

In the event you hit a bump hard enough, and there is nothing keeping the wheel locked in place. The hub bolts will literally sheer off.

Picture this.

Two pieces of wood with a hole in it with a pencil in the hole. If you knock the top wood the pencil will snap. If you have a large metal tube going through both pieces of wood, it will absorb / keep the two pieces of wood from moving so much to break the pencil.

If you are ok with your entire wheel being supported by 5 little $2 bolts then that is up to you. Id rather my wheels held securely centered in place by the wheel hub, and bolted up with the hub bolts.

Plastic or Metal they do the job. The plastic is not going to crush under impact.... They are usually a very dense plastic that can not really be compressed.

I'm sorry, but there is simply no way that the tiny lip on the hub is going to do any good in that situation. How deep is the lip, 15mm max? You talk about the studs shearing off (all 5 of them no less!!) but you think that a little plastic ring won't crush under the same force??

Your wood/pencil example isn't accurate because in that case there isn't lug nuts holding the whole assembly rigid.

Would you set your car down with no lug nuts on it, just hub centric wheels (or wheels with centering rings)? I know there's no way in hell I would do that, not even for a second.

Originally Posted by KONVERTER

You have dowel pins on the transmission dont you? There are not just bolts holding it up to the block. Take out the dowel pins and only use bolts... Same kind of thing...

Ummm, the whole point of dowel pins is to keep it lined up while you're tightening the bolts, they had zero support once the bolts are torqued.

[KONVERTER]

Lines up and also offers support.

I wish you safe driving...

I've sold hundreds of sets of wheels and made sure all my customers had hub rings...

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

[KONVERTER]

Plastic hub rings are a composite material. The impact is distributed over the full surface and there is no gap no where for the wheel to go. They don't crush .

If there is room for the wheel to move (no hub rings) the wheel can move and cut the bolts.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

[chilltpr]

This is my first post here but I have to jump in. Completely agree with KONVERTER. You can also think of it as a balancer and dampener - fills the gap. Ask an aircraft mechanic why a propellar would need this as well. Without it you are relying on the friction of a tapered lugnut on an aluminum wheel.

[KONVERTER]

It is difficult to explain but having your wheels bore hub-centric with your car is very important.

Here is an image from one of my old companies race cars. We had to run a spacer on the car, we made an extended hub that matched up perfectly to the center bore of the wheels.

Not exactly a FT86, but wheels and rules of center bore matching wheel hubs is the same.

Image without the wheels:







My old car wearing one of its many Enkei wheels (RPF1) in an Enkei booth:


Some useful wheel info:

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by KONVERTER

Plastic hub rings are a composite material. The impact is distributed over the full surface and there is no gap no where for the wheel to go. They don't crush .

If there is room for the wheel to move (no hub rings) the wheel can move and cut the bolts.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

With tapered seat lugs there is no room for the wheel to move either. Once torqued they totally fill the space and make it impossible for the wheel to move. If it was running flat seat lugs I would agree, but that's not the case here at all.

Originally Posted by KONVERTER

It is difficult to explain but having your wheels bore hub-centric with your car is very important.

Here is an image from one of my old companies race cars. We had to run a spacer on the car, we made an extended hub that matched up perfectly to the center bore of the wheels.

Not exactly a FT86, but wheels and rules of center bore matching wheel hubs is the same.

Image without the wheels:

Take a look at your two pictures and then look at the stock hub on these cars. On the race car the hub is extended out to go totally through the face of the wheel, on these cars the depth of the flange is like 10-15mm.

On the race car you could probably set the car down without lugs on and have the wheels stay on, on these cars you simply couldn't. The depth of the flange and the offset of the wheels would have the wheel pull off that flange as soon as you put weight on it.

You still didn't answer my question about if you would trust the hub centric rings in RPF1s enough to set a car down without lug nuts on at all.

[KONVERTER]

Originally Posted by wparsons

With tapered seat lugs there is no room for the wheel to move either. Once torqued they totally fill the space and make it impossible for the wheel to move. If it was running flat seat lugs I would agree, but that's not the case here at all.



Take a look at your two pictures and then look at the stock hub on these cars. On the race car the hub is extended out to go totally through the face of the wheel, on these cars the depth of the flange is like 10-15mm.

On the race car you could probably set the car down without lugs on and have the wheels stay on, on these cars you simply couldn't. The depth of the flange and the offset of the wheels would have the wheel pull off that flange as soon as you put weight on it.

You still didn't answer my question about if you would trust the hub centric rings in RPF1s enough to set a car down without lug nuts on at all.

Yes, we built the extended hubs because of the importance of having the wheel being hub-centric.

If you are talking about setting the wheel down with no lug nuts on it? Of course you are better off having a hub-ring in place! If you didnt, you are definitely going to bend or at least start wiggling the hub bolts out of position!

You shouldn't be doing that anyway...???

[KONVERTER]

Thinking about when I had my Z, there was actually a time I had NTO3+M's on it. I accidently had hub rings that were 1mm-ish too small for the center bore of the Z. The wheel wouldn't just go on because of this, I literally had to force the wheel on but torquing down the lugs. Fast forward a couple of weeks and I got the correct rings in, we jacked up the car and removed all the lugs and we couldn't pull the wheels off! We ended up having to get a mallet to pop the wheel off. That is how much the wheel was held in place from hub-rings alone, and they were plastic, and did not crack.

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by KONVERTER

Yes, we built the extended hubs because of the importance of having the wheel being hub-centric.

If you are talking about setting the wheel down with no lug nuts on it? Of course you are better off having a hub-ring in place! If you didnt, you are definitely going to bend or at least start wiggling the hub bolts out of position!

You shouldn't be doing that anyway...???

No no no... you claimed that hub centric rings would hold a wheel in place if you hit a big bump and that it would prevent shearing the studs off, so my question was if the hub flange and hub centric ring/wheel holds so well then you shouldn't have any issue setting the car down without lugs on it since the hub will hold the wheel in place so well.

If the taper seat lugs are seated properly the wheel can't move unless the lug is loosened, so unless the stud strips and the lug falls off, the wheel isn't going anywhere. I trust the strength of 5 lugs more than a single plastic ring any day of the week.

Is this tiny lip really going to do much to hold a wheel on at all??