Track Chronicle of my 2014 BRZ

[AndyBRZ]

Not tapping the brakes for T10, just downshift from 5th to 4th gear and back to full gas. There is a lot of room in T10, as long as you initiate your turn in a timely matter and you position your car all the way to the right of the track before rolling into it. I do the same in my Miata.
For cars with actual power, you have to tap the brakes to transfer weight to the front of the car before you turn in.
As Randy Pobst said, the climbing esses are a test for how much courage you have with the culmination of it being at T10.

[ajh88]

Originally Posted by AndyBRZ

Not tapping the brakes for T10, just downshift from 5th to 4th gear and back to full gas. There is a lot of room in T10, as long as you initiate your turn in a timely matter and you position your car all the way to the right of the track before rolling into it. I do the same in my Miata.
For cars with actual power, you have to tap the brakes to transfer weight to the front of the car before you turn in.
As Randy Pobst said, the climbing esses are a test for how much courage you have with the culmination of it being at T10.

Wow yeah you need some real downforce and tires to take T10 without brakes. What speeds? Guessing around 100? What's your suspension setup?

[AndyBRZ]

ARP wing, front splitter and canards.
Running medium downforce setup for VIR.
Flat bottom and rear diffuser too.
245/40/17 tires. Either my slicks R1's or my street RS3.
104 mph at T10.
Stance coilovers. Good and cheap with plenty of adjustability. I think I have 700lb springs i think but I really do not remember.

Originally Posted by ajh88

Wow yeah you need some real downforce and tires to take T10 without brakes. What speeds? Guessing around 100? What's your suspension setup?

[endless_pain]

Originally Posted by AndyBRZ

Not tapping the brakes for T10, just downshift from 5th to 4th gear and back to full gas. There is a lot of room in T10, as long as you initiate your turn in a timely matter and you position your car all the way to the right of the track before rolling into it. I do the same in my Miata.
For cars with actual power, you have to tap the brakes to transfer weight to the front of the car before you turn in.
As Randy Pobst said, the climbing esses are a test for how much courage you have with the culmination of it being at T10.

If you are downshifting into 4th without any brakes and not bending valves, your rpm's would have been so low that you didn't need to be in 5th.
This is John Adams (FR-S) before he realized downshifting into 4th was not the fastest way and he was still winning TTD at the time. Braking
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VR6YbZlf-e8"]NASA MA (Hyperfest) - 5/2/15 - VIR - TTD Session 3 - YouTube[/ame]


What is 'actual power'? I have 187 (BRZ) at the wheels and before turn in I'm at between 112-117 mph. There is no way I'm making it without Braking:
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3aTw8ARa9s"]NASA Mid-A VIR Unkefer Memorial - Full 360 spin for the lulz - YouTube[/ame]


This is Lufty (FR-S) with a similar setup as yours, braking:
[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLoJ0IehLnA"]FRS VS BRZ (From FRS Camera) VIR NASA 2017 - YouTube[/ame]




Schroth does not recommend the Quickfit or rally style belts for our cars. That PDF is for the wrx/sti. Schroth said it is dangerous.


I asked about how is it possible that you can do 30 track days on a set of front pads and the type of tracks but did not get an answer. I have students with less than half of that track time a year that go thru 2 or 3 sets of front pads. Two years on rear pads? On R1's and RS-3's?


While I can appreciate you sharing your experiences, I can't appreciate misinformation. Your stories have big plot holes and with the Schroth, some dangerous information.

[RallySTI]

Originally Posted by AndyBRZ

Thank you for the advice on the TB. Does anybody know about a better one?
I am thinking McLeod Aluminun flywheel and clutch. It is American.
Any experience with them?

Subaru updated the release bearing for these cars. The new part number is 30502AA150. This bearing (manufactured by NTN) has a better grease to deal with heat. The new release bearing isn't available in the North American aftermarket as of yet.

I work for EXEDY USA as a technical coordinator for the aftermarket, so I have a little bit of insider knowledge on these parts. We are wanting to supply this updated bearing (seems that all Subaru push type release bearings were revised) with our kits but cannot purchase this part from NTN USA as of yet.

I would stay away from the aluminum flywheels. McLeod is an American owned company but that does not mean their products are all coming from the US. They are one of our customers and supply quite a few of our products, modified and/or painted by them.

The aluminum flywheel are light but at a cost. They are all a 3 piece design ( flywheel body, friction surface and ring gear) and this can lead to warping/run-out issues as well as they are not a strong (burst resistant) as a 1 piece forged chromoly/steel flywheels. The biggest issue I personally had with aluminum flywheel is the friction facing becoming warped and causing disengagement issues well before the clutch needed to be serviced.

When the clutch or RB gives out in my 2013 BRZ (daily driven with as many track days as my work schedule allows) here is my plan of attack.

Velox fork and pivot
Updated release bearing from Subaru
(EXEDY clutch and flywheel for apparent reasons)
Either: the TF02 light weight flywheel and stage 1 (22% reduction in mass vs OE)
or the EXEDY Hyper single TH08SDV (dual friction) (33% reduction in mass vs OE)

[AndyBRZ]

My brakes do not wear as bad as your students and I did reply to you telling you what tracks I run mostly through these 30 events. I also told you that perhaps you are talking about the smaller AP Racing rotors. I have the big kit. If we have the same hardware, your students must be braking a lot more than I brake or I can't explain their wear.
I do not get your theory of bending valves as I am in low rpm on 5th before I shift to 4th and I can turn it my car smoothly at that speed as I have downforce. You do not have to believe me, it is fine.
The Schroth file is for and STI and I pointed out the differences that I made to make it work a lot better in my car per the request of the person asking.
Any 4 point harness presents the opportunity of submarining regardless if it is an STI or a BRZ but since you are pulling the safety card please explain how the regular seatbelts without the ability to use a Hans Device are safer than a quick connect harnesses.
I just spent 4 days out in VIR and I find interesting that you are trying to argue over the internet as to how I go through turn 10.

Originally Posted by endless_pain

If you are downshifting into 4th without any brakes and not bending valves, your rpm's would have been so low that you didn't need to be in 5th.
This is John Adams (FR-S) before he realized downshifting into 4th was not the fastest way and he was still winning TTD at the time. Braking

What is 'actual power'? I have 187 (BRZ) at the wheels and before turn in I'm at between 112-117 mph. There is no way I'm making it without Braking:

This is Lufty (FR-S) with a similar setup as yours, braking:

Schroth does not recommend the Quickfit or rally style belts for our cars. That PDF is for the wrx/sti. Schroth said it is dangerous.


I asked about how is it possible that you can do 30 track days on a set of front pads and the type of tracks but did not get an answer. I have students with less than half of that track time a year that go thru 2 or 3 sets of front pads. Two years on rear pads? On R1's and RS-3's?


While I can appreciate you sharing your experiences, I can't appreciate misinformation. Your stories have big plot holes and with the Schroth, some dangerous information.

[endless_pain]

Originally Posted by AndyBRZ

My brakes do not wear as bad as your students and I did reply to you telling you what tracks I run mostly through these 30 events. I also told you that perhaps you are talking about the smaller AP Racing rotors. I have the big kit. If we have the same hardware, your students must be braking a lot more than I brake or I can't explain their wear.
I do not get your theory of bending valves as I am in low rpm on 5th before I shift to 4th and I can turn it my car smoothly at that speed as I have downforce. You do not have to believe me, it is fine.
The Schroth file is for and STI and I pointed out the differences that I made to make it work a lot better in my car per the request of the person asking.
Any 4 point harness presents the opportunity of submarining regardless if it is an STI or a BRZ but since you are pulling the safety card please explain how the regular seatbelts without the ability to use a Hans Device are safer than a quick connect harnesses.
I just spent 4 days out in VIR and I find interesting that you are trying to argue over the internet as to how I go through turn 10.

I'm not arguing.
I understand I don't have to believe you, I'm concerned about the people that do. As instructors, you and I should care about that.
We can finish this conversation next year at the track if you want.

[lutfy]

Originally Posted by AndyBRZ

My brakes do not wear as bad as your students and I did reply to you telling you what tracks I run mostly through these 30 events. I also told you that perhaps you are talking about the smaller AP Racing rotors. I have the big kit. If we have the same hardware, your students must be braking a lot more than I brake or I can't explain their wear.
I do not get your theory of bending valves as I am in low rpm on 5th before I shift to 4th and I can turn it my car smoothly at that speed as I have downforce. You do not have to believe me, it is fine.
The Schroth file is for and STI and I pointed out the differences that I made to make it work a lot better in my car per the request of the person asking.
Any 4 point harness presents the opportunity of submarining regardless if it is an STI or a BRZ but since you are pulling the safety card please explain how the regular seatbelts without the ability to use a Hans Device are safer than a quick connect harnesses.
I just spent 4 days out in VIR and I find interesting that you are trying to argue over the internet as to how I go through turn 10.

Hey Andy,

I like your car setup! Mine is similar to yours (APR 3d wing and front splitter) with MCS DA 550/650 rates and Toyo R888R tires with custom flash. Given my class, I cant do much mods. Like you I am running 2:14s at VIR and believe T10 to be my weakness.

I want to pick up speed at VIR and looked at my data and video and I have to tap the brakes a little bit (but still in 5th) before coming down 10. Even then the car needs to point in and tracks out wide ( am floored past apex again). If you can share data/video be great because I am trying to find time at VIR.

Cheers mate.

Lutfy

[ApexEight]

Originally Posted by endless_pain

I'm not arguing.
I understand I don't have to believe you, I'm concerned about the people that do. As instructors, you and I should care about that.
We can finish this conversation next year at the track if you want.

Can you guys also hash it out here. I don't know who to believe. Lol

And I've also been looking at the Schroth quick connect harness, but if it's not intended for my BRZ/unsafe to use, I want nothing to do with it.

[AndyBRZ]

Hey Lufty, sounds like you are driving well. I totally get what you say to stay on 5th and I did that but as you said, then you have to brake and the turn in T10. For me, lifting before T10, downshifting smoothly to fourth and turning using all track available seems to be faster but unfortunately I have no data as I did not record anything other than lap times.
Maybe you can try that next time and measure or whenever I am there next I will record some data for all.
ApexEigth, I am not encouraging you or anybody here to use what I use. The safest for the track is always 6 point harness with a proper bucket, cage and safety straps and nets. I was quite clear that I had 1/2 cage, bucket and 6 point harness before but I moved into the 4 point harness due to having issues getting in and out the car due to my size and say lack of flexibility on a regular basis and at the track.
EndlessPain, I dig when other FT86 are out there and we can play. Indeed my best memories are when we were several of us playing at the end of the day in the1 hour open track.

[CSG Mike]

@endless_pain would you believe I'm at nearly 20 track days on the same set of pads on my BRZ on stock calipers?

[lutfy]

Originally Posted by AndyBRZ

Hey Lufty, sounds like you are driving well. I totally get what you say to stay on 5th and I did that but as you said, then you have to brake and the turn in T10. For me, lifting before T10, downshifting smoothly to fourth and turning using all track available seems to be faster but unfortunately I have no data as I did not record anything other than lap times.
Maybe you can try that next time and measure or whenever I am there next I will record some data for all.
ApexEigth, I am not encouraging you or anybody here to use what I use. The safest for the track is always 6 point harness with a proper bucket, cage and safety straps and nets. I was quite clear that I had 1/2 cage, bucket and 6 point harness before but I moved into the 4 point harness due to having issues getting in and out the car due to my size and say lack of flexibility on a regular basis and at the track.
EndlessPain, I dig when other FT86 are out there and we can play. Indeed my best memories are when we were several of us playing at the end of the day in the1 hour open track.

I'll have to try it next time. Thanks for the pointer Andy. I am time trialing so chasing seconds... You should come out with us with NASA Mid Atlantic. We're always looking for more FRS/BRZ guys.

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

@endless_pain would you believe I'm at nearly 20 track days on the same set of pads on my BRZ on stock calipers?

Holy S**t. @CSG Mike which pads are you running? I have tried PF08s (6 days and they are gone), DTC60 (3 track days) DTC70 (again 3 days). Killer for us is Summit Point which is hard on brakes. I have OEM caliper, titanium shims and stock blank rotors. Sticking with Hawk because of the contingency dollars. But if you have a better recipe, I am all eyes and ears. Thank you in advance.

Cheers,

Lutfy

[CSG Mike]

Originally Posted by lutfy

Holy S**t. @CSG Mike which pads are you running? I have tried PF08s (6 days and they are gone), DTC60 (3 track days) DTC70 (again 3 days). Killer for us is Summit Point which is hard on brakes. I have OEM caliper, titanium shims and stock blank rotors. Sticking with Hawk because of the contingency dollars. But if you have a better recipe, I am all eyes and ears. Thank you in advance.

Cheers,

Lutfy

Are you ready to spend as much on pads as what entry level Brembo/AP BBKs cost?

[strat61caster]

Originally Posted by CSG Mike

Are you ready to spend as much on pads as what entry level Brembo/AP BBKs cost?

Geez man, I've met drug dealers less shady about their top of the line stuff*


*I'm too lame to actually know any drug dealers