Wonder what Toyota will do if you track this car

[coyote]

It's all a matter of perspective.

You can look upon a part failure as a chance to have an argument with a dealer over your attempt to commit fraud, or as an opportunity to personalise and improve the car with something better.

Once you've identified a weak part, I know which one I'd prefer.

[LexusFman]

Originally Posted by yarik83

Dealer is by no means contractually obligated to service your vehicle unless it was a factory recall. Even then they will only service your vehicle ONLY if changes that you have made to the vehicle did not void factory recall issues.

Case in point.

My 2008 tacoma had airbag sensor failure. Stupid little clock spring plastic assembly that goes behind airbag on steering wheel. Car is not even 4 years old and sensor went bad. I have absolutely no modifications to the vehicle BUT my mileage is 70,000 which is 10,000 over what warranty runs out at. So if I arrived at the dealership at 59,999.99 miles they would have fixed it for free but if I entered dealer's lot with 60,000.01 they would have told me to pay... which I did.

On my tacoma forums tons of members are having warranty issues where dealer denies service because trucks have been lowered/raised/suspension changed etc. Simple as that... dealer is not obligated to do anything to your vehicle if they feel that vehicle has been tampered with.

Lets say you wanted to change your hood to carbon fibre hood and down the road hood flew off ripping out hinges and messing up your windshield and roof and fenders... dealer would not cover that repair because hinges did not fail under normal expected conditions of stock hood. Even if it was a stock hood they would probably tell you that you are stupid for forgetting to close down your hood.

Lets say you wanted to lower your car and your alignment became out of whack, control arm bent etc etc... dealer would not honor warranty related claim because car was modified.

When you buy a car there are like 25 pages of fine print that you have to read that tells you all conditions which will result in warranty to be void.

If you take your car to the track... there will be damage somewhere sometime but do not expect manufacturer or the dealer to fix it for free because their mechanics and claims specialists are not stupid either.

If a modification is made to the car it doesn't automatically void your warantee. I do beleove their is a law against that. What happens is the company has to prove the modification is the cause of the failure. You could do a RWD, 2JZ Swapped 2012 Corolla but if you still have the stock radio in, it is covered under warantee. Same thing with a Pro FWD Toyota Camry. The dealer CAN refuse service though but as someone else said that doesn't mean you can't complain.

[2fast4you]

Originally Posted by LexusFman

If a modification is made to the car it doesn't automatically void your warantee. I do beleove their is a law against that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuson–Moss_Warranty_Act

[subaruslow]

Originally Posted by ft86Fan

Toyota keep suggesting that the best use of the rear seat is to fold them and put a set of tires and take it to the track. This is great coming from a manufacture but I wonder whether Toyota will still honor your warranty if you do. Just like Lotus keep suggesting that the Elise/Exige is a track car for the street but when you do take it to the track you can say bye bye to the warranty.

had thunderhill inspection sticker on windsheild when i got my brake pads serviced under warranty for sti brembos.

[CXTKRS1]

Originally Posted by LSxJunkie

However, don't expect to be able to walk into a dealership you've never been in before and try to get a blown diff replaced no questions asked.

Funny that is exactly what he did.

[Mulder]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

The dealer/manufacturer has to PROVE that the aftermarket part caused the damage.

This has not been my experience. Not even with completely stock cars. The burden of proof of fault falls onto the owner. As an example, a friend of mine bought an 08 STI. The engine wasn't running right, and Subaru refused to do any tests to prove anything was wrong. My friend had to shell out $400 from his own pocket for a compression test to prove to them the engine was screwed. It was. Then they tried to deny warranty coverage saying that he'd clearly hit something because of a big flat dent in his transmission casing. I looked at it for him, because he said he hadn't hit anything, and told him it looked to me like it was cast that way, maybe even intentionally. He went and looked under another STI, and sure enough, same flat dent cast into every casing. He had to convince someone to drive to the dealership with him to PROVE to the dealership that his flat dent was OEM, not damage.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Mulder

This has not been my experience. Not even with completely stock cars. The burden of proof of fault falls onto the owner. As an example, a friend of mine bought an 08 STI. The engine wasn't running right, and Subaru refused to do any tests to prove anything was wrong. My friend had to shell out $400 from his own pocket for a compression test to prove to them the engine was screwed. It was. Then they tried to deny warranty coverage saying that he'd clearly hit something because of a big flat dent in his transmission casing. I looked at it for him, because he said he hadn't hit anything, and told him it looked to me like it was cast that way, maybe even intentionally. He went and looked under another STI, and sure enough, same flat dent cast into every casing. He had to convince someone to drive to the dealership with him to PROVE to the dealership that his flat dent was OEM, not damage.

That's a retarded dealer. After the first part he should have called Subaru and not even bothered with the rest of it.

[Mulder]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

That's a retarded dealer. After the first part he should have called Subaru and not even bothered with the rest of it.

Oh he did. This story is much much longer, and it only gets worse. The short of it is that Subaru doesn't give a hoot about honoring their warranties. They'll try to screw you every chance they get no matter at a dealership or straight from Subaru of America. Currently this particular STI is sitting in his garage, not running. Having gone through 2 engines and a transmission, now the 3rd engine toast again. My friend finally gave up trying to get things fixed under warranty and is just saving for a built Cosworth engine.

[Dave-ROR]

Originally Posted by Mulder

Oh he did. This story is much much longer, and it only gets worse. The short of it is that Subaru doesn't give a hoot about honoring their warranties. They'll try to screw you every chance they get no matter at a dealership or straight from Subaru of America. Currently this particular STI is sitting in his garage, not running. Having gone through 2 engines and a transmission, now the 3rd engine toast again. My friend finally gave up trying to get things fixed under warranty and is just saving for a built Cosworth engine.

Stock engine? That is pretty bad.

Back in the day they covered damage from a local rallycross that resulted in a number of damaged WRXs and STIs, the local dealer fixed them all under warranty.

[Mulder]

Yup. Stock engines. They tried repeatedly accusing him of abusing the engines and racing, but they had no proof. It's an STI, it's going to be driven hard. DUH.

[SUB-FT86]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

Here's my take on the situation: saying it can go to the track is primarily a source of bragging rights for the vast majority of buyers than have never been nor will ever go to the track. It's mainly marketing.

[bambbrose]

Here is section C of 15 USC 2302

(c)
Prohibition on conditions for written or implied warranty; waiver by Commission
No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumer’s using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade, or corporate name; except that the prohibition of this subsection may be waived by the Commission if—
(1) the warrantor satisfies the Commission that the warranted product will function properly only if the article or service so identified is used in connection with the warranted product, and
(2) the Commission finds that such a waiver is in the public interest.
The Commission shall identify in the Federal Register, and permit public comment on, all applications for waiver of the prohibition of this subsection, and shall publish in the Federal Register its disposition of any such application, including the reasons therefor.



Notice that there are waivers to the rule, stating that they can deny warranty due to modification, but only if they satisfy #1 and #2. How would one go about searching the federal register regarding waivers to Subaru / Toyota regarding the use of OEM components?

[trueno86power]

It really depends on dealer. I'm working at a Chrysler dealership and if the modification do not cause damage to the car, we don't give a $hit.

When modification cause damage then we don't cover it. And that is 100% normal.

My friend have a '09 Corolla XRS and the local dealer is really a bitch for tuning parts. For exemple, his car was making some random misfires. He have a Weapon short ram air filter installed... guess what was the cause for the dealer tech? The short ram.

He was in !"(&!") and leave, he call me after that. I hook up my cheap 20$ scanner to check the code, search a TSB on the net. Found one, with the date of fabrication of the car and the DTC matching, I've print and highlighted everything and he go with that at the dealership. The engine harness was to replace and they FINALLY have replace it.

[WolfpackS2k]

I've also heard a lot of bad publicity about Subaru with their STIs. Someone on a local car forum here in NC blew his 2008 STI's engine while still under warranty. He hadn't been abusing it and Subaru accused him of running the engine with a low oil level. After countless attempts he had to pay for the engine replacement himself. Stuff like this (and the stories about SCCA Autox'ing voiding warranties) makes me want to stay away from Subarus.

Originally Posted by ft86Fan

Oh, they stopped that a long time ago. Almost all insurance companies now say that as long as your car is on the track, it is not covered. Doesn't matter if its called High Performance Driving Education (HPDE) or that its not timed. If you want insurance for track days you'll have to buy it separately from insurance companies that offers it. Usually by the days.

Before I started doing HPDEs with my S2000 I called my insurance agent (Traveler's Insurance) and explained what I was planning to do. They said I was covered as long as it was an untimed event. Naturally I document conversations like this

Hey ft86Fan where do you live in Basking Ridge? I spent 4 of my childhood years growing up just off Mt. Airy Road. Loved that town.

As to dealerships and honoring warranties its my understanding that tracking a stock vehicle should not be grounds for voiding it. Especially a SPORTS car, which is designed to play with. Obviously if you are not a good driver then abuse is possible but in my opinion driving a vehicle hard around a track for a weekend is not abuse. This statement stands with the understanding that the only modifications you are making for the track are what's needed, like track only brake pads, stickier (but not R comp) tires and possibly brake cooling ducts if needed. My S2000 is no longer under factory warranty but is still under an extended one, and I've talked candidly with a service manager about attending track days.