Honda J series v6 swap?

[Bawlz]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

Better bet for me would be the LFX out of say a 2013 Camaro. Same engine in the Cadillac CTS. Available *image* with twin turbos from the factory also.

The LFX is an excellent engine when Turbo/Super charged. I'm at 480whp & 440wtq on my stock auto-trans in mine with the IPS Twin turbo kit & some bolt ons. It's light, cheap & easy to find. Just a Supercharged one at 6-9 psi would be great in a twin.

[venturaII]

Just in case anyone forgot where they're posting, it's the "Engine Swaps" section, not the bolt-ons/FI kits/19" wheel section. Engine swaps aren't for everyone. The door is over there, if you can't grok the concept.

[civicdrivr]

Originally Posted by swarb

OK, I will play along. Say the motor cost with harness and shipping is $1500. add in 3500 swap kit and 1300 aem ecu. And a tune on a engine not many people tune to begin with. Then you have to modify the intake manifold. And possibly the oil pan as our hoods sit pretty low. $6300 before fabrication and tune. I'd say that isn't exactly cost/labor effective.

Look at the dyno video 3.2 dyno TUNED at 236hp 209tq, not exactly impressive numbers. And the stock miata diff/trans is a ticking time bomb.

Second video, crooked steering wheel drives me crazy, that just shows you what kind of work they do.

That is not a tuned J32A2. The video states that its stock, and looking at the dyno graph in the video, I am inclined to agree. 235/210 at the wheels is typical for a bone stock J32A2. Breather mods on these engines (intake manifold, intake, headers, exhaust) typically bump output to around 265-275whp untuned.

I had a stroked J32A2 in my 2003 CL-S. It utilized J35 rods and pistons with a J37 crank (which made it approximately a 3.6l) and it was making 294/275 at the wheels untuned. This was before I addressed the exhaust and headers. It was running pig rich above 5K rpm (my AFR gauge was reading below 11:1 from 5k to redline). I have no doubt in my mind that that car would've made 310/290ish, but I parted it out shortly after I got the FRS.

Since I sold that car, Hondata FlashPro was released for the 3G TL, and quite a few guys in the J community have been making 280whp or better on J32A3s. J35s (07-08 TL-S) are making around 300whp with simple bolt ons. If torque is what you're after, get a J37. Those are good for 310/290ish at the wheels with simple bolt ons. Cams are available if you'd like even more power.

These engines can handle about 7-8psi on stock components. 7-8psi on a turbo'd J32A2 is typically good for about 425whp. I know one guy that is running way more than that through a stock block and he's making just shy of 700hp. This, of course, is in a drag civic.

These engines do not make LS power without some form of boost, but they do make very good power when you know what you're doing with them. They're packaged very tightly, and they're very reliable. I didn't have a single problem with my J32 for 50k miles before I stroked it, and I didn't have an issue in the 50k miles afterwards either.

I will agree with you about the steering wheel though.

EDIT- Admittedly, I looked into doing this swap. One of my biggest concerns is finding a good location for the starter. The swap kit in the OP moves the starter below the motor (which requires a notch in the oil pan), which is what they do with S2000 when performing this swap. But on the 86, you've got the steering rack right there. Unless you raise the engine (no thanks), find a way to put the starter on the transmission side, or find another location for it, I don't see how it would fit in the bay properly.

Sent from my XT1095

[raven1231]

Originally Posted by Bawlz

The LFX is an excellent engine when Turbo/Super charged. I'm at 480whp & 440wtq on my stock auto-trans in mine with the IPS Twin turbo kit & some bolt ons. It's light, cheap & easy to find. Just a Supercharged one at 6-9 psi would be great in a twin.

Interesting seeing someone outside the tristate area using IPSmotorsports. Their work is top notch

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by civicdrivr

EDIT- Admittedly, I looked into doing this swap. One of my biggest concerns is finding a good location for the starter. The swap kit in the OP moves the starter below the motor (which requires a notch in the oil pan), which is what they do with S2000 when performing this swap. But on the 86, you've got the steering rack right there. Unless you raise the engine (no thanks), find a way to put the starter on the transmission side, or find another location for it, I don't see how it would fit in the bay properly.

Finally, some knowledgeable input.

[Dream20b]

Pretty sure you can make the same HP with full bolt ons, Sprintex SC and e85. You'll have less headaches, Better reliability once you factor in that swaps are usually unreliable if not done by an experienced professional, and you're changing the weight balance of the car substantially due to moving the engine's location.

[swarb]

@civicdrivr dude look at the video. look at the swap parts. intake manifold modded(but stock), it has a intake, and I doubt you can use a stock exhaust so that is modded. And it doesnt mention header. There are two dyno plots, it is DYNO TUNED as my post before says. Lets not talk about swapping cranks and turbo'ing it. And then mentioning not making LS power.

The whole point of any swap is usually 3 things.
1. cheap/affordable/cost effective, which this is not, especially when you have to do custom fabrication and a bunch of labor when compared to something like a jackson racing super charger which can be installed and tuned in a day.
2. fast, kinda, but not really for the price, unless you time is free or you have lots of it.
3. reliable, yes because honda, no because engines are used as these older motors have been sitting.

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by swarb

The whole point of any swap is usually 3 things.
1. cheap/affordable/cost effective, which this is not, especially when you have to do custom fabrication and a bunch of labor when compared to something like a jackson racing super charger which can be installed and tuned in a day.
2. fast, kinda, but not really for the price, unless you time is free or you have lots of it.
3. reliable, yes because honda, no because engines are used as these older motors have been sitting.

You've missed the most important part of a swap, and it's not one that can be explained, if you don't already get it. Fine - you've made it perfectly clear that you'd rather bolt on some parts. There are other sections more appropriate for your type of mods and comments.

[Koa]

Originally Posted by venturaII

You've missed the most important part of a swap, and it's not one that can be explained, if you don't already get it. Fine - you've made it perfectly clear that you'd rather bolt on some parts. There are other sections more appropriate for your type of mods and comments.

You've missed the most important part of his advice: Your swap idea sucks

[wparsons]

Originally Posted by Dream20b

Pretty sure you can make the same HP with full bolt ons, Sprintex SC and e85. You'll have less headaches, Better reliability once you factor in that swaps are usually unreliable if not done by an experienced professional, and you're changing the weight balance of the car substantially due to moving the engine's location.

There is simply no way that an FA20 with full bolt ons, supercharger and aggressive e85 tune is going to be anywhere near as bulletproof as a 100% stock honda engine.

Will the FA20 be decently reliable, sure, but it'll be in a whole different ballpark than something bone stock.

Personally I wouldn't bother with a honda V6. I'd either want a K20 (good for ~250whp easily without boost), or LSx. Not much point in swapping anything else IMO.

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by Koa

You've missed the most important part of his advice: Your swap idea sucks

There's plenty of people who think swaps suck, in general, until they see they can be done, and done well. There's already a successful business performing swaps with the J series into Miatas and a few other platforms. So unless you have something actually technical in content to contribute to this thread, I'd say your attitude is what sucks, and you're just trolling.

[venturaII]

Originally Posted by wparsons

Personally I wouldn't bother with a honda V6. I'd either want a K20 (good for ~250whp easily without boost), or LSx. Not much point in swapping anything else IMO.

The K series was brought up as a candidate due to making close to what a stock J32 makes for peak power, but being lighter. While it's true that it's lighter, it's still down on power, plus it's WAY down on torque, which is one of the big problems the FA20 has in the first place. The J series splits the difference between the K20 and the LSx, in terms of size, weight, and power, and is likely the cheapest of the bunch.


The starter location mentioned earlier IS an issue, so perhaps that might be what keeps this idea from working, unless a solution can be found. I'm not sure if the kit location is due to requirements of the Handa motor, or the Miata transmission. But given the fact that a different adapter plate would be required to mate the Honda motor with the Toyota transmission anyways, and that our starter is already on the transmission side of things AND at the top of the transmission, it might be an easier solution than you think. Or not. lol

[NOHOME]

Originally Posted by venturaII

Just in case anyone forgot where they're posting, it's the "Engine Swaps" section, not the bolt-ons/FI kits/19" wheel section. Engine swaps aren't for everyone. The door is over there, if you can't grok the concept.

Who knew that Martians were into engine swaps?


(Let's see who else can figure that out)

[Tcoat]

Originally Posted by NOHOME

Who knew that Martians were into engine swaps?


(Let's see who else can figure that out)

I can! Won't ruin it with a pic though.