New rumor: Subaru FT-86 Version Could Have 60hp More Than Toyota FT-86

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by [es vi: eks]

A lot of wrong things in that artical... this one above I noticed.. Its using that asien or what ever 6 spd gbox. Not the subaru 6spd

Especially considering the Subaru transmissions have a center differential and assorted AWD stuff built into it.

Note where the front axles come out of the transmission in the pic.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Especially considering the Subaru transmissions have a center differential and assorted AWD stuff built into it.

Note where the front axles come out of the transmission in the pic.

That can be fixed. There's a kit to take off the center diff. Also a caps to close the front axles. IIRC wasn't there a guy use to race in Formula D in STI just taking out the front axles and put back the front axles for the Rally.

[70NYD]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

That can be fixed. There's a kit to take off the center diff. Also a caps to close the front axles. IIRC wasn't there a guy use to race in Formula D in STI just taking out the front axles and put back the front axles for the Rally.

but that would not be done to a production car esp since the GB with all the extra gears inside will be heavier and more expensive to manufacture

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by 70NYD

but that would not be done to a production car esp since the GB with all the extra gears inside will be heavier and more expensive to manufacture

I'm not saying, I'm all for it. Dimman brought up Center Dif & front axles problem. I just said, there's solution for that.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

I'm not saying, I'm all for it. Dimman brought up Center Dif & front axles problem. I just said, there's solution for that.

Sure it can be modified, but this is supposed to be an inexpensive shared development. As a project lead do you:

a: Take an existing transmission that needs extensive modifications (Subaru AWD version)?

or

b: Go with an existing transmission that is already setup for the prescribed RWD setup that just needs a bellhousing change (maybe not even)?

Since the answer, to me at least, seems obvious, that would lead me to conclude that the article is wrong on the transmission choice. Further following this logic, the strange explanation of a (large!) Legacy platform with new-generation Impreza rear suspension is also likely wrong.

Continue through to all points of the article and I might as well write my own article about it, and be just as correct as they are.

It's not that it can't be done, it's that it realistically shouldn't and won't be done.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Sure it can be modified, but this is supposed to be an inexpensive shared development. As a project lead do you:

a: Take an existing transmission that needs extensive modifications (Subaru AWD version)?

or

b: Go with an existing transmission that is already setup for the prescribed RWD setup that just needs a bellhousing change (maybe not even)?

Since the answer, to me at least, seems obvious, that would lead me to conclude that the article is wrong on the transmission choice. Further following this logic, the strange explanation of a (large!) Legacy platform with new-generation Impreza rear suspension is also likely wrong.

Continue through to all points of the article and I might as well write my own article about it, and be just as correct as they are.

It's not that it can't be done, it's that it realistically shouldn't and won't be done.

Oh I totally agree w you... but that doesn't mean they gonna be stupid & choose #a.

It's the Subie ver, not the Toyota ver. Subie doesn't have to have same chassis layout was Toyota. They can do what ever they want it their ver. Current STI's tranny is awesome, so I don't see why not putting that tranny in and make it new Coupe STI again... and maybe 3 dr ver.

[70NYD]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Oh I totally agree w you... but that doesn't mean they gonna be stupid & choose #a.

It's the Subie ver, not the Toyota ver. Subie doesn't have to have same chassis layout was Toyota. They can do what ever they want it their ver. Current STI's tranny is awesome, so I don't see why not putting that tranny in and make it new Coupe STI again... and maybe 3 dr ver.

now that would be a car i would be proud to own
but realistically the article said that the only thing diff between the 2 cars is the bumpers/hood/lights which means that the chassis is the same. this follows suit to what badge engineering is anyway. we can all guess and speculate but until ther is OFFICIAL news of ANY sort everything else is just that.. speculation.
btw i wasnt attacking you in my previous post, i was just saying that its not financially feasible to use a AWD tranny on a RWD setup from a mass production point of view. from a buyers point of view, them using a AWD gb in the production model would mean that there would be a posiblity of making the car AWD with some modifying making this light weight car just awesome for everything, bar drifting

[Dimman]

The thing is, Ichi, that if you look at the front of the car, and how forward the front wheels are, think of how forward the engine would have to be to use Subaru's normal AWD layout. From the proportions of the car, the motor will probably be behind the front axles, Subaru's AWD will not be feasible with this design...

Sorry to break the hearts of any Subaru faithful that may be praying for an AWD version.

It may also be less drift-friendly.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by 70NYD

now that would be a car i would be proud to own
but realistically the article said that the only thing diff between the 2 cars is the bumpers/hood/lights which means that the chassis is the same. this follows suit to what badge engineering is anyway. we can all guess and speculate but until ther is OFFICIAL news of ANY sort everything else is just that.. speculation.
btw i wasnt attacking you in my previous post, i was just saying that its not financially feasible to use a AWD tranny on a RWD setup from a mass production point of view. from a buyers point of view, them using a AWD gb in the production model would mean that there would be a posiblity of making the car AWD with some modifying making this light weight car just awesome for everything, bar drifting

Yes, current hatch is awesome looking imo, so I can't wait to see if they can make coupe & coupe hatch ver.

Realistic? What was so realistic bout this article? Nothing! Didn't have any realistic fact bout this.

Subaru still can make totally different FT86 ver for their side. They still haven't show any concept at any auto shows (yet)... other than spy pic & vid at the Nur track & even that was just put together current Subaru chassis parts to test the AWD & RWD set-up. That's why all those auto blog/online places guess that Subaru gonna use current Legacy & Impreza parts for it (whatta f'ckin morons). I don't remember Subaru stating next car will have current Legacy & Impreza parts.

correct me, if I'm wrong.

& I photoshop current STI sedan into coupe (AWD ver of course). If they make kinda like this (or even better) concept at the auto show... IDK, if I have enough $ to buy both FT86 & coupe. lol

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Yes, current hatch is awesome looking imo, so I can't wait to see if they can make coupe & coupe hatch ver.

Realistic? What was so realistic bout this article? Nothing! Didn't have any realistic fact bout this.

Subaru still can make totally different FT86 ver for their side. They still haven't show any concept at any auto shows (yet)... other than spy pic & vid at the Nur track & even that was just put together current Subaru chassis parts to test the AWD & RWD set-up. That's why all those auto blog/online places guess that Subaru gonna use current Legacy & Impreza parts for it (whatta f'ckin morons). I don't remember Subaru stating next car will have current Legacy & Impreza parts.

correct me, if I'm wrong.

& I photoshop current STI sedan into coupe (AWD ver of course). If they make kinda like this (or even better) concept at the auto show... IDK, if I have enough $ to buy both FT86 & coupe. lol

I can think of MANY Subaru guys that would dump the 216a in a heartbeat if they could get an STI Impreza coupe instead.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Dimman

The thing is, Ichi, that if you look at the front of the car, and how forward the front wheels are, think of how forward the engine would have to be to use Subaru's normal AWD layout. From the proportions of the car, the motor will probably be behind the front axles, Subaru's AWD will not be feasible with this design...

Sorry to break the hearts of any Subaru faithful that may be praying for an AWD version.

It may also be less drift-friendly.

Like I said, I totally agree w you. That doesn't mean anything.

Did any auto show that next Impreza or next gen car will be FR? I don't think so.

Like I said to 70NYD, Subaru still can do anything they want to next car. Why they gonna follow same chassis as Toyota? Subaru haven't shown official concept of this car yet. It's all speculation and nothing official. Just some spy pic and vid was see here and there... but that's all.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Dimman

I can think of MANY Subaru guys that would dump the 216a in a heartbeat if they could get an STI Impreza coupe instead.

...I'll be one of em.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by ichitaka05

Like I said, I totally agree w you. That doesn't mean anything.

Did any auto show that next Impreza or next gen car will be FR? I don't think so.

Like I said to 70NYD, Subaru still can do anything they want to next car. Why they gonna follow same chassis as Toyota? Subaru haven't shown official concept of this car yet. It's all speculation and nothing official. Just some spy pic and vid was see here and there... but that's all.

I think the idea of the project is so they don't HAVE to make an entirely different car. This way they get an attention-getting sports car with Toyota supplying most of the money and using some existing Subaru parts.

Think of the Porsche Cayenne and VW Touareg. Different, yet the same.

Also remember that Toyota is the boss here.

Also if they don't change it around too much they have more resources available if they want to do the Impreza coupe.

[ichitaka05]

Originally Posted by Dimman

I think the idea of the project is so they don't HAVE to make an entirely different car. This way they get an attention-getting sports car with Toyota supplying most of the money and using some existing Subaru parts.

Think of the Porsche Cayenne and VW Touareg. Different, yet the same.

Also remember that Toyota is the boss here.

Also if they don't change it around too much they have more resources available if they want to do the Impreza coupe.

No offense but... who said that? I don't remember them saying it like that. Toyota just stated they gonna be using Subaru's boxer engine in FT86 and it'll be FR. When that happened spy cameras were seeing coupe Subaru test driving around Nur. Subaru said they'll use Toyota FT86's tech to make their ver (216a). Rest are all speculations.

Hm... I can't agree on Toyota been the boss. Yes, Toyota have certain power over Subaru... but that doesn't stop Subaru from going different way.

FT86 is already a great resource for Subaru. If they want, they can make next gen SVX making it H6 w Toyota/Yamaha engineered Head (& add one more cylinder each on each side).

Pretty much until we actually see the Subaru ver, all we can do is speculate.