Subaru BRZ STI Concept (2011) Revealed!

[PAImportTuner]

Best thing about this is the current SRRTUSA guys are but 20 minutes away, where they build some of the nicest track cars as well. http://www.phoenixperformance.net/ I can see them building this car and running it in the series. Then you'll see it on SPEED.

[tripjammer]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

The difference is the Rx8 makes 200whp to the 200hp the FRS makes. So shifting into a lower gear will multiply the torque on both of them and it becomes a non issue. That gets old really quick for me though, but at least the RX8 has a long linear powerband and top end to work with. This car will not display this it will have same low end and good mid-range and choke up top, to give that fun, snappy, less time in gear feel.

At this point the RX-8 or NC MX-5 is the better car.

It depends on what they sell this car at..Price will make the difference. Plus the build quality...but yeah a turbo would be hell of a nice!

[cynic]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

At this point the RX-8 or NC MX-5 is the better car.

"better" is entirely subjective. An MX-5 does not have rear seats,has less carrying capacity, is a convertable. RX8 drinks oil, has relatively small mid-range torque, is relatively heavy.

Please don't shoot me down in flames; I am just pointing out that different people have different priorities.

Regards,
C

[Kage]

Originally Posted by cynic

"better" is entirely subjective. An MX-5 does not have rear seats,has less carrying capacity, is a convertable. RX8 drinks oil, has relatively small mid-range torque, is relatively heavy.

Please don't shoot me down in flames; I am just pointing out that different people have different priorities.

Regards,
C

I agree with you entirely. I dont see how either of those cars would count as "better" especially the rx8

[spin9k]

Originally Posted by cynic

"better" is entirely subjective. RX8 drinks oil, has relatively small mid-range torque, is relatively heavy.

Regards,
C

Originally Posted by Kage

I agree with you entirely. I dont see how either of those cars would count as "better" especially the rx8

Agreed "better" needs a frame of reference, however...

The RX-8 does not "drink oil", it uses it for the same purpose as a piston engine, just differently...

As there is no oil sloshing around in a crankcase under the pistons and rings for lubrication (no pistons, no rings) but rather a rotor and seals not exposed to oil spray, the way lubrication is done is to inject oil mist directly into the combustion chamber where it lubricates the seals and rotor housing. Oil usage depends on the ECU regulating the injectors according to the severity of use.

Normal driving sees no more oil consumption than many piston engines, of course track usage is higher, but the point is to safeguard the engine, as high rpm running is what it LOVES to do, and does well.

If you want to 'see' (feel would be a better term) how good the RX-8 is, get someone to take you for a ride, or better, a track run. Beyond epic handling capabilities way above its pay grade, it has an electric motor like 'flat' torque curve, a very wide and flexible power range 4.5-9K rpm and doesn't mind being rung out without mercy at or near redline for 10, 20 or more minutes under race conditions without any undue raucous, or concern for harm. In fact, it comes alive under such conditions, and is entertaining and very enjoyable track scalpel under those conditions.

It's only limitiation is brute HP, exactly like the FR-S, which means both are momentum cars, with the RX-8 having a better power/weight ratio even still so you see the term "better' is up for debate.

See you at the track!

[cynic]

l

Originally Posted by spin9k

so you see the term "better' is up for debate.

See you at the track!

I have not driven an RX8 at the track,only around the streets.It was only a brief introduction. My perceived lack of midrange drew a poor opinion from myself. I am not trying to degrade the car. I am saying it didn't appeal to me.

"Normal driving". Once again you are using terms without reference. Define normal driving. Is driving to work in peak hour normal? Is hooning down your favourite piece of winding road normal? Driving to the shops? Rotaries seem to have a reputation for higher oil consumption than reciprocating engines.

As for "better". The term is not up for debate. Your use of the term is up for debate.

Unless you care to visit Australia you will not see me at the track.

Regards,
C

[PAImportTuner]

Originally Posted by cynic

"better" is entirely subjective. An MX-5 does not have rear seats,has less carrying capacity, is a convertable. RX8 drinks oil, has relatively small mid-range torque, is relatively heavy.

Please don't shoot me down in flames; I am just pointing out that different people have different priorities.

Regards,
C

The FRS might as well be a 2 seater. The rear seats are not usable with kids. You can't even fit backwards infant installed seats without eating the steering wheels.. if that or forward facing toddler seats without crushing your kid's legs. My MINI has just enough clearance for my forward facing kids, which has more seat room and capacity then the FRS. This car will have NO room. So you might as well have a lighter weight convertible Miata in that aspect.

I might as well have a RX-8 because of it allowing 4 adults to sit in it, has a better power to weight ratio, better weight balance, smooth broader powerband, and fun filled high rpm range. The oil is only consumed due to heavy usage, just like any other conventional motor, if you drive it from point A to B then it will not burn like you say.

So these are "better" and cost less overall when you put them side to side and compare features and performance.

[Nurburgring]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

So these are "better" and cost less overall when you put them side to side and compare features and performance.

- The Miata is slower, smaller, the stock suspension is a nice design but way too softly sprung in stock form, the CG is higher, roll stiffness is lower, and the looks are debatable. Cool car but I don't see where it is superior to the FT86. The weight difference alone is not enough to make up for all the other weak points.

- The RX8 is almost 300lbs heavier, gets lousy gas mileage, and production has already stopped in August so it will NOT be a competitor for FT86 sales; now if you want to talk used cars that's a whole different story.

[chulooz]

Also oil is always being consumed in the RX8's rotary, this is done by design and it is not like any other conventional motor.

From what has been seen, the rear seats are being advertised to have some practical function, like everything on this forum we will just have to wait till the release.

[n2oinferno]

Originally Posted by PAImportTuner

The FRS might as well be a 2 seater. The rear seats are not usable with kids. You can't even fit backwards infant installed seats without eating the steering wheels.. if that or forward facing toddler seats without crushing your kid's legs. My MINI has just enough clearance for my forward facing kids, which has more seat room and capacity then the FRS.

Do you sit all the way back? I fit into the back of a MCS and I'm 6'3". Took a test drive with a friend when he was looking and the sales guy didn't want to get in the back. I was surprised how much room I had.

[PAImportTuner]

There is no winning, if you haven't owned any of the cars in question than you really can't speak on them. Fortunately I have.

[n2oinferno]

Nothing to be won or lost here. I'm not sure why you say I can't speak on it, considering I actually did get back there. I just wondered because of my experience sitting inside of one for 20-30 minutes. We got rid of my wife's Yaris because it was just a bit too small to put the rear-facing seat in the back with the front passenger seat all the way forward, and it seemed like there might be just a hair more room in the Mini than there was in the Yaris.

[SUB-FT86]

I think some people are misunderstanding what some people meant about having good usable torque. A car with weak torque will get the job done on regular roads but for some people it can be a pain in the ass especially if you have passengers and other shit in the car. I bought my GF a 2000 civic and I hate driving that POS. Feels like im destroying the car just to accelerate and the car is light(2350 lbs) with 107lb ft of torque.

[CyberFormula]

Liking the BRZ more than the FRS now.

The front where the LED lights are Looks good, even though I don't care for the LED...its the shape of it that reminds me of the GT3 porsche.

In addition the Rear looks good too.

I hope BRZ won't come with RC radio attenaes..