VSC Sport, Trac Off, Both Off - Which do you use for normal driving?

[wbradley]

I concur that so far the car's handling has proven to be stable and predictable. And, I do like to have a little fun with it sometimes.
However, if I decide to drive this car in the winter the nannys stay ON! I do believe there is a significant added margin of safety for snow/ice with them.
Also, if I am doing my commute on the highway any time they stay on.

They get switched off every once in a while when I'm in the mood to play but based on the demographics of the majority of buyers here (younger male with little RWD experience) I'd say many should be more conservative for now.
I already rolled my car when I was 22 (I'm 48 now).

[russv]

Originally Posted by ABQautoxer

I disagree. This is much like anything, why shouldn't they be able to turn it off. Both companies, in all their wisdom, made it a button right next to the shifter. Sure seems convenient for something that so damn taboo. What so stupid about this whole debate is you do realize the number of cars that did not have these things for 100 years. I'm not saying they aren't an improvement, what I am saying is simply the idiots of the world will crash their cars anyway because in the end its personal judgement. You can still have some awesome crashes with all the nannies on.

I will agree with you to some degree. I would wager that most drivers today have only driven cars with the "nannies" and have never driven ones' without them. I learned to drive before they even existed and took the cars out to dirts roads to see how they handled so I would have at least some knowledge about their limits. Those of you who have owned the old VW bugs know what I'm talking about. That said, I would never turn the nannies off while driving on the street.

[TSY]

Originally Posted by feedbag

Is there a reason these are all FRS's? Maybe BRZ drivers are better?

One thing people have been saying is that they have been driving RWD cars for year. With Stability control automakers are able to set up the suspension more aggressively knowing the VSC will save an inexperienced driver. Before VSC a lot of these cars were purposefully set up to understeer to keep the people buying their cars safer. The stock setup on my 944 Turbo is conservative and when pushed will understeer. A few simple alignment changes and the car quickly becomes a handful even in experienced hands.

These cars are designed to handle well and they do, but they can become a handful if you're not paying attention all the time. The stability control will save you if you happen to lose concentration for a moment. . . Unless of course you turn it off, in which case we see what happens when our cars go off roading.

[ill86]

Every winter I overhear someone talking about how wonderful vsc is. How they were able to cruise to work without slowing down even with snowy and icy roads. All the while not realizing they're pushing the limit of the vehicle. Never even considering what would have happened without the electronic aids.

My friend in an FJ Cruiser bragged about how VSC saved him when he went into a turn too fast. He has no feel for the car. Relies on the electronics to drive it. What do you think happens when he drives another car without it? He crashes.

By all means leave the electronics on if that's what you like. But to tell others it's stupid to turn them off because you can't handle it is utterly ridiculous.

Learn to drive in a controlled environment with a professional instructor. Just so you can.. Even if you never want to. You'll be surprised at what you will learn.

I am available for hire for those around the Pittsburgh PA area. Skid pad and all...

Happy motoring.

[Zadkiel]

Originally Posted by TSY

Is there a reason these are all FRS's? Maybe BRZ drivers are better?

One thing people have been saying is that they have been driving RWD cars for year. With Stability control automakers are able to set up the suspension more aggressively knowing the VSC will save an inexperienced driver. Before VSC a lot of these cars were purposefully set up to understeer to keep the people buying their cars safer. The stock setup on my 944 Turbo is conservative and when pushed will understeer. A few simple alignment changes and the car quickly becomes a handful even in experienced hands.

These cars are designed to handle well and they do, but they can become a handful if you're not paying attention all the time. The stability control will save you if you happen to lose concentration for a moment. . . Unless of course you turn it off, in which case we see what happens when our cars go off roading.

The top one is a BRZ. Although how you spear off on a straight stretch of road is beyond me. I can only imagine they were trying to DORIFTO!!!!!!!!! like a bunch of tools.

[TSY]

Originally Posted by Zadkiel

The top one is a BRZ. Although how you spear off on a straight stretch of road is beyond me. I can only imagine they were trying to DORIFTO!!!!!!!!! like a bunch of tools.

Ah, didn't look carefully enough. Still, probably more wrecked FRSs than BRZs. Subaru owners tend to be more educated.

[S2kphile]

Gotta make sure to keep an eye out on junkyard for OEM parts. Seems like there is gonna be plenty to pick from. Here's hoping to find a FRS bumper intact

[brzltd]

Toyota GT 86 Traction Control Demonstration

Toyota GT 86 Traction Control Demonstration [SKIDPAD] - YouTube

[wbradley]

Originally Posted by TSY

Ah, didn't look carefully enough. Still, probably more wrecked FRSs than BRZs. Subaru owners tend to be more educated.

I is resenfull you say that. Lotsa FR-S owners is edutated.

[chulooz]

Originally Posted by res

I leave all the nannies on when driving on public roads. One mistake without them and you may be dead, someone else may be dead, or someone else may own you.

Good luck.

paranoia?

[Zadkiel]

Originally Posted by brzltd

Toyota GT 86 Traction Control Demonstration

Toyota GT 86 Traction Control Demonstration [SKIDPAD] - YouTube

Good thing I don't plan on turning it off when there's a torrential downpour on a slick surface?

[pinoyplaya]

So I went and redline the car last night as I entered the highway, first gear then clutch in to 2nd gear... boom! Traction control light kept flashing and prevented me from accelerating any further.

[Miniata]

My BRZ isn't used as a daily driver and I never commute to work in it, the car (my Miata) I usually commute in is RWD with no stability control, traction control, or ABS. When I drive the BRZ I'm out to have fun on the roads, or I'm driving it somewhere (autocross) to have fun, but I don't take unnecessary chances or put anyone elses life in danger. If the roads are dry every thing gets turned off as soon as I remember to do it, if the roads are wet, I leave traction and stability control on.

Been driving for 26 years, owned 20+ cars (about half RWD), been autocrossing for 13 years, this is my first car with stability control, and only my 3rd car with any sort of traction control. If I had my choice I'd prefer to be able to buy a new car with no traction control, stability control, airbags, TPMS, and ABS would be user-defeatable with a switch.

[TSY]

Originally Posted by wbradley

I is resenfull you say that. Lotsa FR-S owners is edutated.

My apologies. Yoo'r rite.

[TSY]

Originally Posted by pinoyplaya

So I went and redline the car last night as I entered the highway, first gear then clutch in to 2nd gear... boom! Traction control light kept flashing and prevented me from accelerating any further.

No, it's the lack of hp that prevented you from accelerating.

But seriously, the TCS kicking in was probably because you were about to spin your rear wheels and you wouldn't be accelerating anyway. Either that or because you hit the rev limiter.

[Khyron686]

Originally Posted by TSY

No, it's the lack of hp that prevented you from accelerating.

..Either that or because you hit the rev limiter.

Yep, done it a few times.

In sport mode, you shouldn't see the lights unless you're driving like a jackass and something is actually slipping/sliding. In other words, a situation where you are liable for a stunting or careless driving ticket. There is no excuse for that on a public street (not saying I haven't done it - but I'm ready to pay as well...)

My tune might change this winter - we'll see.

[neutral]

Just sitting here reading an interesting debate, and someone just HAD to post THESE pictures:

Originally Posted by feedbag

Not cool man

lol

[res]

Originally Posted by chulooz

paranoia?

Nope, plain simple common sense. That's why it is called an accident. Something happened you did not expect and now it is time to pay the piper. I only hope when some of the larger ego's mess up that no one has to pay the price with an injury or worse.

I am just saying that you reduce the odds of something unexpected causing an issue with the nannies engaged, even if your name was Stirling Moss.

Good luck.

[Vracer111]

I just want to add the VSC and ABS system has absolutely no idea what to do ON TRACK if you leave it in Sport mode and have actual sticky tires mounted....very annoying having ABS going off (or more precisely trying to go off while not really doing anything but pumping the pedals for effect only because the tires have at no point come close to loosing grip...) and engine cutting out a little screwing up corner exit speeds. With everything off the car brakes better and handles better. Does the same thing on the street to a much much lesser extent. But there is a difference you can feel between everything off and the systems on if you are in tune with the chassis and it has nothing to do with being even remotely close to driving recklessly on the road. It has everything to do with how the car is communicating with you... I want as free, and pure a communication from the car as possible verses artificial barrier's/filters which take some of it's soul/character away. It is a tangible difference you can feel after taking you first turn from a stop...and is the difference between being one with the car and just driving the car.

[pinoyplaya]

Originally Posted by TSY

No, it's the lack of hp that prevented you from accelerating.

But seriously, the TCS kicking in was probably because you were about to spin your rear wheels and you wouldn't be accelerating anyway. Either that or because you hit the rev limiter.

I think because it spun. I was in 2nd gear just after shifting when the TCS light came on. I thought it was the CEL light at first and scared the crap outta me.

[bucket]

Originally Posted by TSY

No, it's the lack of hp that prevented you from accelerating.

But seriously, the TCS kicking in was probably because you were about to spin your rear wheels and you wouldn't be accelerating anyway. Either that or because you hit the rev limiter.

So for everybody except for 25 Year Driving Instructor Guy, this should be the most relevant statement. If you're driving around with everything on and the nanny intervenes, then you were most likely over-driving. Sure, you probably wouldn't have crashed, but you also were not driving optimally...try taking that corner again without triggering VSC. If you feel that the electronic aids are an insult to your Driving God Ego, then think of them as a cup full of water that makes you drive just like Takumi.

[TSY]

Originally Posted by brzltd

Toyota GT 86 Traction Control Demonstration

Toyota GT 86 Traction Control Demonstration [SKIDPAD] - YouTube

This is a nice video. The second run with the VSC on sport allows a little oversteer before intervening. Also the fastest run through the slalom of the 3 modes.

The slowest? The runs with the VSC off. Doing donuts doesn't help lap times. At higher speeds that guy would be off in the weeds- or up a tree.