Gearbox: Cable Link or Mechanical Link?

[Marrk]

Originally Posted by Dave-ROR

You will get notchiness with a good direct mech link transmission. If you aren't feeling anything in the shifting process you won't feel anything any other time either.

So yes, IMO, it does need to be notchy when cold to feel direct. Every good MT I've ever driven is notchy when cold.. current press isn't just views it as noteworthy (good or bad) because it's not normal, but neither is an excellent shifter. :shrug:

And yes, coming out of gear IS a problem. Notchiness when cold is NOT.

We're going in circles. Let me drive the car and we'll talk again.

[brz7400]

BRZ shifter is just fine, very slick and light to operate.
But then my other car is an '05 Corvette which has a rock crusher box and won't even go into 1st gear about 1/3 of the time on first try from stop, lol.
The BRZ shifter is slick and fast, but feels a bit fragile, so I have learned to work it gently.
Only thing I don't like about it is the centering force on it. It is so weak/light that when I try to downshift quickly from 5th to 4th, it doesn't center itself quick enough to find 4th a few times. Actually have to think and help nudge the shifter to center itself as it goes from 5th to 4th.
There is no real notchiness, unless you are trying to downshift into 1st gear, which I never do.

[dori.]

Are there any RWD cars from Japan with a cable linkage? I've owned 2 in the past and both were mechanical.

[Laika]

All this talk about a notchy shifter just makes me want to go drive my car.

Coming from a german saloon that had a sloppy 6MT even with a short shifter, the BRZ is a godsend. That car was made to not feel sporty because it's a luxury car....I wanna feel every mechanical thing I possibly can in a sporty/sports car like the BRZ. Seriously, drive the car and you'll get it. It's not something that makes you think there's a problem with the trans but rather something that lets you remember you bought a sports car and not an econobox/luxury sedan.

[JP]

http://www.purcellperformance.com/Te...13%20FR-S).pdf

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by JP

http://www.purcellperformance.com/Te...13%20FR-S).pdf

Good find.

[uspspro]

the MR2 (all generations) and the Lotus Elise use shift cables.

[Marrk]

Originally Posted by uspspro

the MR2 (all generations) and the Lotus Elise use shift cables.

and the Lotus Elise gearbox famously sucs ballz, bro. Can't comment on the MR2. Never drove it.

[Jeff Lange]

For transverse-mounted setups, cables are very common. Honda liked to use mechanical linkage for a long time, but even they have now switched to cables, much easier to route, etc. Same reason throttle pedals went from mechanical linkage to cables as well (before going DBW now of course). This includes most FF, MR and RR setups and some AWD setups. There are exceptions to all of this of course.

For RWD setups that don't use a rear transaxle, the shifter is usually either mounted right into the extension housing on the rear of the transmission case (especially on older cars which commonly had a shifter that came out of the console/floor much further forward and sloped back towards the driver), or it is remotely-mounted with a tripod or similar shifter extension. These setups are more common now that the more typical shifter setup is to have the shifter itself more vertical, and you move it along that plane.

The remote extension shifter is what most current non-truck setups seem to be employing, and the TL70/AZ6 in the Zx6 is no exception.

Here's a diagram from the 1993 JZA80 Supra NCF book illustrating the difference in shifters between the older and newer transmissions. It sort of helps illustrate the 2 common RWD shifter setups, with (especially from Toyota/Lexus), the "New" one being much more common now.



Jeff

[groucho]

Originally Posted by uspspro

the MR2 (all generations) and the Lotus Elise use shift cables.

I suspect that most mid/rear-engine cars use cable shifters, especially those with transverse engines. A quick Google check indicates that Porsche uses cable shifters in the Boxster/Cayman, and I believe the 911 also. My old mid-engine Porsche 914 (which IIRC used a 911 shifter) had a cable shifter, and the feel was OK but nothing special.

I was a LITTLE disappointed with the shift feel when I first picked up my BRZ, but it "broke in" and I'm pretty happy with it now. It is definitely not as short as I had hoped, and the feel isn't quite as good as I hoped, but it's very good, certainly much better than your usual FWD/AWD shifter. My Elan is still the benchmark that I compare everything else to, though... I had hoped the BRZ would match it, but alas, it doesn't. I'm still loving the BRZ though!

[BMWDavid]

All water cooled Porsche 911's (996, 997 and 991) use a cable linkage shifter. Some of them such as the GT3's are actually quite nice. The air-cooled 911's all had a rod that went back to the trans and they have a nice solid mechanical feel.

[Marrk]

I drove the FRS today.

The gearbox is not "notchy" in any negative way. What you feel is the direct linkage doing its job. I did not experience anything that I would call "notchy."

I would say that the gearbox is like the S2000, but not as tight and not as short a throw. Also, the 3-4-5-6 shifts felt a little off. Hard to find the gates. Maybe just take some getting used to. Owners with seat time can comment on this.

I agree with Groucho above. Some cable linkage systems seem to work just fine. My Fit has a lovely little gearbox for a $15K five-speed econo-box. And, as noted, Porsche uses cable linkages (as well as MacPherson front suspension).

[GFo12ce]

Originally Posted by Marrk

Now that the cars are out in the hands of retail buyers, do we now know for certain whether the gearbox has a cable linkage or a mechanical linkage or something else?

I haven't seen anyone post on this. In fact, I haven't noticed a lot of comments regarding the MT gearbox.


Thanks.

Are you referring to a shifter linkage? This is a RWD car, the shifter goes directly into the transmission. I noticed you drive a Fit so I understand where you are coming from (FWD) but there is no need to link the shifter to the trans via any linkage in a RWD car. The Trans sits behind the engine, not beside the engine like in a FWD:

[vividracing]

[GFo12ce]

Originally Posted by vividracing

LOL WTF, I guess I stand corrected. I worked for HKS USA, I've owned a Hachi, S13, S14, JZA80 Supra, and a Z and that's the first RWD trans I've seen with that configuration. I guess you learn something new every day...

[Jeff Lange]

Originally Posted by GFo12ce

LOL WTF, I guess I stand corrected. I worked for HKS USA, I've owned a Hachi, S13, S14, JZA80 Supra, and a Z and that's the first RWD trans I've seen with that configuration. I guess you learn something new every day...

The JZA80 has the same type of shifter linkage. Never looked under the car? LOL.

Jeff

[Marrk]

Originally Posted by GFo12ce

Are you referring to a shifter linkage? This is a RWD car, the shifter goes directly into the transmission. I noticed you drive a Fit so I understand where you are coming from (FWD) but there is no need to link the shifter to the trans via any linkage in a RWD car. The Trans sits behind the engine, not beside the engine like in a FWD:

I believe Porsche and Lotus, to name two, use cable linkage. Most are quite happy wih Porsche. Most think that Lotus gearboxes suc ballz.

[Jeff Lange]

Neither Porsche or Lotus use a similar setup to what an FR car does though, which is why they use cables. They are MR/RR.

Jeff

[Marrk]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lange

Neither Porsche or Lotus use a similar setup to what an FR car does though, which is why they use cables. They are MR/RR.

Jeff

Thanks. I know that.

[Jeff Lange]

I figured, I just thought I'd clarify for others. People in this thread keep saying "RWD" when they really mean FR, since MR/RR are usually more typically related to an FF setup than an FR setup, even though they are driving the rear wheels.

So many exceptions to all of this though, but I don't think I can think of an FR setup that didn't use a transaxle in the rear with a cable setup.



Jeff

[GFo12ce]

Originally Posted by Jeff Lange

The JZA80 has the same type of shifter linkage. Never looked under the car? LOL.

Jeff

It's been 10 years and it's the only car I wish I never sold. Maybe I'm blocking it out mentally lol. Honestly no though, I did the cams and turbo upgrade parts, had SP Engineering do the clutch back then.

Anyway great car. Looking forward to driving one soon.