Should I trade in my 370z?

[eriktherod]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

It's funny since your the first person that has ever said this. I also have a hard time believing this unless you are used to a 2.2L V6 from 1989 or something.

Oh, hm well.. I'm not used to a sports car V6 but.. compared to the other V6's I've driven I feel like it's similar to the 'lazy' power at lower rpms compared to many 4cyls.

[switchlanez]

I used to drive a G35 and its V6 has plenty of pickup on tap from a standstill. Also used to have a Celica GT-S, Mk2 MR2 (2.2L), and Mk3 MR2. The BRZ feels like it has a bit more punch (its hp/tq figures are higher) at low RPMs than those inline-fours but you still feel a gradual increase in pull as the revs build.

[Juan@aePerformance]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

The fuel starve issue is the only one that hasn't been solved, and it can be avoided if you keep a full tank before tracking.

The oil and brake cooling issues can be fixed for less than 1000 dollars.

I'm not sure but i think we added a secondary tank to our 370 and we hardly ever get fuel starvation issues anymore. Only thing thats sucks is that our fuel gauge is a little off now.

[Liquidsnake]

Originally Posted by fatoni

okay maybe its a communication thing. azz=back, planted=not moving. do we agree? back not moving = understeer. so if you think the frs has more understeer than the 370z. i think youre wrong. if you dont, i dont understand what you are trying to say. the 370z is a much more stable car because it is designed to be driven at much higher speeds. i dont think anything mentioned is beyond reason

I don't know man my Z always scared me on turns. A few people who drove my old car told me they didn't trust it. I kind of agreed with them. Straight line no problem. 0-120 in a straight line put a smile on my face. With the FRS I trust that car with my life on turns. It's just my experience and opinion with both cars. Z was a little sloppy and it didnt feel tight to me.

[shadoquad]

Originally Posted by Liquidsnake

I don't know man my Z always scared me on turns. A few people who drove my old car told me they didn't trust it. I kind of agreed with them. Straigh line no problem. 0-120 in a straight line put a smile on my face. With the FRS I trust that car with my life on turns. It's just my experience and opinion with both cars. Z was a little sloppy and did t feel tight.

I believe that it's personal preference. The Z is a bit more "understeer into corner, power into oversteer out". But I trust it in every bend. I need to drive an FRS hard into some proper twisties to make a comparison, though.

[Liquidsnake]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

I believe that it's personal preference. The Z is a bit more "understeer into corner, power into oversteer out". But I trust it in every bend. I need to drive an FRS hard into some proper twisties to make a comparison, though.

I once fucked a BMW 640 in a straight line the look on the guys face was priceless. I'll never forget it. The Z was an awesome car.

[ZDan]

Understeer entering a corner and oversteer out is exactly what you *don't* want. You want the car to eagerly rotate on crner entry and stably track out while applying max power on exit.

[SUB-FT86]

I honestly believe the next Z will get a 2.0L turbo(295hp/280tq) engine next with 250lbs(2950lbs) shed from its body and slightly better balance. I don't think Nissan will go the N/A 4 cylinder route and I wouldn't blame them if they don't.

[shadoquad]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Understeer entering a corner and oversteer out is exactly what you *don't* want. You want the car to eagerly rotate on crner entry and stably track out while applying max power on exit.

It's how the car is set up. Its staggered wheel setup creates natural understeer, and the 300 ponies means you can correct a corner by simply gassing it.

Don't get me wrong, drivers who track their Z's tend to go with a square setup to avoid that. But I love that handling style. Hard cornering is very easy and rewarding in the car.

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I honestly believe the next Z will get a 2.0L turbo(295hp/280tq) engine next with 250lbs(2950lbs) shed from its body and slightly better balance. I don't think Nissan will go the N/A 4 cylinder route and I wouldn't blame them if they don't.

I'll be really surprised if Nissan puts a 4 cyl in a Z. They've never done it before. Although, BMW once said they would never turbo their M cars, and that happened.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

It's how the car is set up. Its staggered wheel setup creates natural understeer, and the 300 ponies means you can correct a corner by simply gassing it.

Staggered tires are only a part of the overall equation. They could (and would) have given it the same handling balance with a non-stag/square setup from the factory.

The effect of some tire stagger isn't that huge relative to front/rear roll stiffness distribution and alignment settings anyway. I've run 205/225, 205/245, and 225/245 on my S2000 at the track, and honestly the balance wasn't tremendously affected.

Don't get me wrong, drivers who track their Z's tend to go with a square setup to avoid that. But I love that handling style. Hard cornering is very easy and rewarding in the car.

I've driven a 350Z back to back at New Hampshire Motor Speedway's road course vs. my S2000. For sure the FR-S handles a lot more like the S2000. Definitely my preference...

In any case, at the track you definitely don't want understeer entering and oversteer exiting corners. Fortunately, trail-braking naturally gives some oversteer on corner entry and application of power unloads the fronts and gives understeer on track out.

I'll be really surprised if Nissan puts a 4 cyl in a Z. They've never done it before. Although, BMW once said they would never turbo their M cars, and that happened.

What Nissan should do (according to me):
Develop a new Silvia very similar to the FR-S/BRZ
Build a new Z on that platform, with engine/firewall/windshield/front-seaters moved way aft, back seat removed. Honestly I'd rather see a new 4 cylinder 250Z that weighed 2800 lb or less than a 3000+ lb. 6-cylinder new Z, but if they keep the weight down, 4, turbo-4, 6, turbo-6, whatever is fine with me.
Also build a 510 lineup on the same platform. 2-, 3-, 4-, 5-doors. Like a Mazda3 but RWD.

That'd be a kick-ass lineup...

[shadoquad]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Staggered tires are only a part of the overall equation. They could (and would) have given it the same handling balance with a non-stag/square setup from the factory.

The effect of some tire stagger isn't that huge relative to front/rear roll stiffness distribution and alignment settings anyway. I've run 205/225, 205/245, and 225/245 on my S2000 at the track, and honestly the balance wasn't tremendously affected.

I've driven a 350Z back to back at New Hampshire Motor Speedway's road course vs. my S2000. For sure the FR-S handles a lot more like the S2000. Definitely my preference...

In any case, at the track you definitely don't want understeer entering and oversteer exiting corners. Fortunately, trail-braking naturally gives some oversteer on corner entry and application of power unloads the fronts and gives understeer on track out.

Well, I haven't hit the track with the Z yet. That's happening in October. But on the Tail of the Dragon, she handles like a wet dream, to me.

Originally Posted by Zdan

What Nissan should do (according to me):
Develop a new Silvia very similar to the FR-S/BRZ
Build a new Z on that platform, with engine/firewall/windshield/front-seaters moved way aft, back seat removed. Honestly I'd rather see a new 4 cylinder 250Z that weighed 2800 lb or less than a 3000+ lb. 6-cylinder new Z, but if they keep the weight down, 4, turbo-4, 6, turbo-6, whatever is fine with me.
Also build a 510 lineup on the same platform. 2-, 3-, 4-, 5-doors. Like a Mazda3 but RWD.

That'd be a kick-ass lineup...

I'm hoping they bring back the S, have that as a 4-cyl entry to compete with FRS/BRZ/MX5. RWD. Hoping they increase the power of the Z a bit, maybe with forced induction. Although, really, if you can't have fun with 330hp, you're doing something wrong And keep the GTR as the halo car. I see no need to bring back the 510 name. They don't need to enter the hot hatch market, but if they did, it'd be sweet.


Sorry, I'll take off my Nissan fanboi cap for a while now

[fatoni]

Originally Posted by ZDan

Staggered tires are only a part of the overall equation. They could (and would) have given it the same handling balance with a non-stag/square setup from the factory.

The effect of some tire stagger isn't that huge relative to front/rear roll stiffness distribution and alignment settings anyway. I've run 205/225, 205/245, and 225/245 on my S2000 at the track, and honestly the balance wasn't tremendously affected.

I've driven a 350Z back to back at New Hampshire Motor Speedway's road course vs. my S2000. For sure the FR-S handles a lot more like the S2000. Definitely my preference...

In any case, at the track you definitely don't want understeer entering and oversteer exiting corners. Fortunately, trail-braking naturally gives some oversteer on corner entry and application of power unloads the fronts and gives understeer on track out.



What Nissan should do (according to me):
Develop a new Silvia very similar to the FR-S/BRZ
Build a new Z on that platform, with engine/firewall/windshield/front-seaters moved way aft, back seat removed. Honestly I'd rather see a new 4 cylinder 250Z that weighed 2800 lb or less than a 3000+ lb. 6-cylinder new Z, but if they keep the weight down, 4, turbo-4, 6, turbo-6, whatever is fine with me.
Also build a 510 lineup on the same platform. 2-, 3-, 4-, 5-doors. Like a Mazda3 but RWD.

That'd be a kick-ass lineup...

?

Originally Posted by shadoquad

Well, I haven't hit the track with the Z yet. That's happening in October. But on the Tail of the Dragon, she handles like a wet dream, to me.


I'm hoping they bring back the S, have that as a 4-cyl entry to compete with FRS/BRZ/MX5. RWD. Hoping they increase the power of the Z a bit, maybe with forced induction. Although, really, if you can't have fun with 330hp, you're doing something wrong And keep the GTR as the halo car. I see no need to bring back the 510 name. They don't need to enter the hot hatch market, but if they did, it'd be sweet.


Sorry, I'll take off my Nissan fanboi cap for a while now

they dont need to enter any market really

[SUB-FT86]

If Nissan makes a similar version to the FRS/BRZ I hope they don't use a 2.0L or smaller engine for the N.American market. They can keep it in JP/EU but give us a D/I, 2.5L(7k RPM) or a 2.0T.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by fatoni

?


they dont need to enter any market really

S cars have back seats. I think he's talking platform sharing. New S16 gets 4 cyl and 2+2, Z gets 6 cyl and 2 seats. Based on shared chassis.

Same thing Toyota should do with 86, IMO. Like the original Celica and Supra variants, sort of.

[Z.Tune]

Originally Posted by jinrawke

My sixth sense tells me that you have already made up your mind and want to go from the Z to the BRZ/FRS. Here are my suggestions since I actually got rid of a car to get the BRZ.

1) Test drive one. and right after drive your Z for comparison.
2) Think of what you value more. Some may place a premium on power, acceleration, how much HP, passing speed on the highway. Others value agility, how connected you are with the road, or even simply how the car looks. Others may not even care about those and just want high quality interior and smooth ride.

My experience:
I had a 2009 IS 250 that I sold in order to get my BRZ. The comfort and luxury were nice but I never felt a connection with the car. The IS 250 was just a daily driver car and I never really felt like it was MY car, just a method of transportation. I appreciated it for what it did but never once did I say, damn I just feel like driving. I used to feel that way when I owned a CRX and later a Prelude (I just have a love for sports cars).
Many questioned my decision, including myself - why would you go from an 09 IS 250 to a sub 30k sports car without ever test driving it, let alone seeing it in person? it only has 200 hp, why dont you just get the new mustang. are you nuts?
Well... Yes
Once I saw all the reviews and also a few comparisons on how it handled like a CRX, I was sold. My CRX was the funnest car I owned. It was not fast (unless u dropped in an Integ engine in it), it was not luxurious, it was not roomy... yet that didn't matter much to me. I valued the driving experience and this is EXACTLY what I get with my BRZ and I could not have been happier. I expected to have some sort of remorse on my decision but thankfully that is not the case.

Good luck with whichever way you decide!

Thank you so much for ur opinion, and the Mustang is great if: lighter, independent rear suspension. And I hear its coming.

Originally Posted by Honeydew

You really serious? ...sigh i think i dont want to slant into being a hater bu i cant help it...i for one could not afford a Z and i love that car.. and now you wish to sell the Z for an fr-s ...oh god this world ...."Want what you dont have"...why waste time and effort the Z is a great car -.-w

Oh, I m not decide yet. I love the Z, very much. But I can have only 1 car for now.

Originally Posted by shadoquad

Z owner here, figured I'd chime in.

side note, I wondered where you'd gone, Liquidsnake lol

I tested an FRS a week or two ago. Much like the overwhelming advice in this thread, I say go test the Scion to be sure. I had wanted to see what it was like from the moment they said they were producing them. I also have a background driving tossable lightweight cars like a Miata, a Z4, and a v6 Fiero. My first car was a Fiat Spider.

a Z4 is not light, lol

Anyway, after driving the FRS, I came away with the impression that I'm happier sticking with my Z than trading, but that the FRS is impressive for what it is. I still might personally want a Miata over an FRS at the price range, but it's really close.

What I liked:
FRS is just as pretty as the Z imo, which is to say it's gorgeous.
Clutch and shifting was pleasant and sporty.
Took a while, but revving past 5k was fun.
Engine bay is spacious, would be a fun car to turn wrenches on.

What I didn't:
Interior materials were a bit cheap, car didn't feel refined inside.
Was hoping for sharper turning response and tighter turn radius.
Engine was rough at idle (Subaru owner I know told me that this could be because the engine is new or was mistakenly filled with low-grade fuel)

I wish I'd had better roads to test the handling on, because I got the impression that the car would be screaming fun on twisty mountain roads. Again, I place it right with the Miata, so my personal buying decision between the two would rest on whether I wanted a drop top or back seats.

It's a nice, affordable sports car. I'm keeping my Z, though. I paid 30k for my Z, so it's not THAT much more pricey, but I feel it's more car.

Great info, all I care about is performance, thanks!

Originally Posted by Jordo!

I own a 370Z, so listen to me very carefully.

No. Keep your Z. Unless you can't afford the payments, keep it and wait for either a boosted version of the FR-S/BRZ or whatever the next model Z will be.

Really, the only drawback on the Z is that it could be lighter. Well, spend some money improving the brakes (better pads, SS lines) and bracing the chassis and it will feel easily 200 lbs lighter.

I understand what u mean, but what i need is real lighter

The FR-S/BRZ is a great car, but in its present form, it can't hold a candle to the 370Z. It's a 2+2 MX5 -- add 50-75 whp/wtq and it will be a giant killer... but we're not there yet.

True, I might just wait, but I can't wait to mod my car, so after all, if i moded my z and a new FRS came out, I m seriously dun know what to do.... LOL

Originally Posted by Juan@aePerformance

we're returning our 370z and getting another FRS. The Z is a great platform and is great for the track. The blind spots are insane though. Can't see anything out of that car lol. The z has fuel starvation issues and oil temp issues. we resolved that on our car for the most part with AE brand oil cooler. But going into limp mode sucks.

I like them both, but i'll be getting an FRS or BRZ.

The only blind spots i have in the Z actually the left mirror that blocks my sight to see the left side when waiting a stop sign. I m not short but my waist isn't long, and I like to sit low. YES, THE FUEL STARVATION IS VERY SCARY. I didn't know that until one time it has 2 dots of fuel left(about 50 miles), then suddenly became "---- miles left"!! I afraid I was going to push it to get gas....

Originally Posted by Ericfrs

Hi there,

I just sold my 2009 black 370z 6mt with spk to get a ultramarine 6auto FR-S.

I love my Z and its been a blast to drive, but I decided to sell my full paid Z because I only use it as a daily driver. Unlike you, I have never been to tracks and it is also my only car.
I haven't WOT in my frs yet Since it only has less than 200 miles on her. But what I can tell you is just how light the frs feels on its feet when compared to my Z.
I think the Z feels very secure and heavy when driving on the street like a train when compared to the frs gocart feel. I also love how the frs takes corners, its just feels effortless to turn even if on a steep hill. The Z was powerful on its right, but I had to generate much more noise to make her go if you know what I mean XD

All in all I think I made the right choice for a daily driver, and I just took two passengers with me around town yesterday！ amazing.

Hope you get a test drive of the frs soon！

Eric

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR INFO!

Originally Posted by shadoquad

The fuel starve issue is the only one that hasn't been solved, and it can be avoided if you keep a full tank before tracking.

The oil and brake cooling issues can be fixed for less than 1000 dollars.

LOL, the oil cooler cost me 600+, but its a big one tho

Originally Posted by FT_Monk

OP should keep the Z until a more powerful BRZ/FRS versions are here. Lazy Nissan mounted windshield washer bottle right on the front bumper does not help handling. Some weight reduction in the front will helps.

Agree with the wait plan, but seriously have no idea how to make the z a lot lighter.... sigh..

Originally Posted by Liquidsnake

I don't know man my Z always scared me on turns. A few people who drove my old car told me they didn't trust it. I kind of agreed with them. Straight line no problem. 0-120 in a straight line put a smile on my face. With the FRS I trust that car with my life on turns. It's just my experience and opinion with both cars. Z was a little sloppy and it didnt feel tight to me.

Maybe u pushed too much gas? or too early?

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

I honestly believe the next Z will get a 2.0L turbo(295hp/280tq) engine next with 250lbs(2950lbs) shed from its body and slightly better balance. I don't think Nissan will go the N/A 4 cylinder route and I wouldn't blame them if they don't.

Umm... I think it will be still a v6... if the power goes down, the marketing of the z will change a lot. turbo? dun think so, cost too much money. IMO

Originally Posted by ZDan

Staggered tires are only a part of the overall equation. They could (and would) have given it the same handling balance with a non-stag/square setup from the factory.

The effect of some tire stagger isn't that huge relative to front/rear roll stiffness distribution and alignment settings anyway. I've run 205/225, 205/245, and 225/245 on my S2000 at the track, and honestly the balance wasn't tremendously affected.

AGREE

I've driven a 350Z back to back at New Hampshire Motor Speedway's road course vs. my S2000. For sure the FR-S handles a lot more like the S2000. Definitely my preference...

That should be a good news, S2K is awesome

In any case, at the track you definitely don't want understeer entering and oversteer exiting corners. Fortunately, trail-braking naturally gives some oversteer on corner entry and application of power unloads the fronts and gives understeer on track out.

nice

What Nissan should do (according to me):
Develop a new Silvia very similar to the FR-S/BRZ
Build a new Z on that platform, with engine/firewall/windshield/front-seaters moved way aft, back seat removed. Honestly I'd rather see a new 4 cylinder 250Z that weighed 2800 lb or less than a 3000+ lb. 6-cylinder new Z, but if they keep the weight down, 4, turbo-4, 6, turbo-6, whatever is fine with me.
Also build a 510 lineup on the same platform. 2-, 3-, 4-, 5-doors. Like a Mazda3 but RWD.

That'd be a kick-ass lineup...

VERY AGREE THE Z SHOULD LOSE WEIGHT! S16?!?! I ll sell my house, lol

[Honeydew]

Just keep it if your seeking performance maybe wai a year or two there might be a fine tunned one?

[shadoquad]

Originally Posted by Z.Tune

The only blind spots i have in the Z actually the left mirror that blocks my sight to see the left side when waiting a stop sign. I m not short but my waist isn't long, and I like to sit low. YES, THE FUEL STARVATION IS VERY SCARY. I didn't know that until one time it has 2 dots of fuel left(about 50 miles), then suddenly became "---- miles left"!! I afraid I was going to push it to get gas....

That is not fuel starve. That is the trip computer not knowing how much is left to go.

Fuel starve means that you're low on fuel and driving hard (I mean TRACKING IT hard) and you take a sweeping right turn with low fuel, and the G forces pull the fuel away from where it is grabbed from the tank, shutting the car down. That is fuel starve. Not knowing how many miles you can go before running out of gas, that's nothing. As a rule of thumb, I always assume I have less than thirty miles to go in any car with the fuel light on. Just fuel up when your gas light comes on and it's not a problem.

As for fuel starve, most Z owners will never drive their cars hard enough to ever experience it.

LOL, the oil cooler cost me 600+, but its a big one tho

Mine cost 400 and we installed it in an afternoon. Fixes the oil heat issues permanently. Brake heat issues can be addressed with higher tolerance brake fluid (60 bux), better pads (300 bux), and if you're really feeling frisky, the Stillen brake cooling kit, but that's not necessary.





At the end of the day, trade the Z if you want to. We only go around once in life. Test drive the FRS/BRZ, and if you like it more, then trade it. What's good for me is not necessarily good for you.

[serialk11r]

Originally Posted by SUB-FT86

If Nissan makes a similar version to the FRS/BRZ I hope they don't use a 2.0L or smaller engine for the N.American market. They can keep it in JP/EU but give us a D/I, 2.5L(7k RPM) or a 2.0T.

A reduced friction VVEL 2.5L engine would be awesome...but the smaller the motor the less incentive there is to put fancy stuff like that on :/ Which is why the VQ25 doesn't have it. Fuel economy concerns will push displacement down since that's the cheapest way to get fuel economy.

[Z.Tune]

Test drive is later this afternoon, lol

[Isamu]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

That is not fuel starve. That is the trip computer not knowing how much is left to go.

Fuel starve means that you're low on fuel and driving hard (I mean TRACKING IT hard) and you take a sweeping right turn with low fuel, and the G forces pull the fuel away from where it is grabbed from the tank, shutting the car down. That is fuel starve. Not knowing how many miles you can go before running out of gas, that's nothing. As a rule of thumb, I always assume I have less than thirty miles to go in any car with the fuel light on. Just fuel up when your gas light comes on and it's not a problem.

As for fuel starve, most Z owners will never drive their cars hard enough to ever experience it.

Mine cost 400 and we installed it in an afternoon. Fixes the oil heat issues permanently. Brake heat issues can be addressed with higher tolerance brake fluid (60 bux), better pads (300 bux), and if you're really feeling frisky, the Stillen brake cooling kit, but that's not necessary.





At the end of the day, trade the Z if you want to. We only go around once in life. Test drive the FRS/BRZ, and if you like it more, then trade it. What's good for me is not necessarily good for you.

repped! fuel starve sucks if you actually hit it...

[Zadkiel]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

Well, I haven't hit the track with the Z yet. That's happening in October. But on the Tail of the Dragon, she handles like a wet dream, to me.


I'm hoping they bring back the S, have that as a 4-cyl entry to compete with FRS/BRZ/MX5. RWD. Hoping they increase the power of the Z a bit, maybe with forced induction. Although, really, if you can't have fun with 330hp, you're doing something wrong And keep the GTR as the halo car. I see no need to bring back the 510 name. They don't need to enter the hot hatch market, but if they did, it'd be sweet.


Sorry, I'll take off my Nissan fanboi cap for a while now

Makes me regret selling my S13 to help pay for my house. I had a Versa at that point and barely drove the 240 at all. I couldn't justify keeping it around anymore.

[ZDan]

Originally Posted by shadoquad

I'm hoping they bring back the S, have that as a 4-cyl entry to compete with FRS/BRZ/MX5. RWD. Hoping they increase the power of the Z a bit, maybe with forced induction. Although, really, if you can't have fun with 330hp, you're doing something wrong

Z doesn't need more power so much as it needs to lose ~500 lb.!

And keep the GTR as the halo car.

Honestly, I'd rather they had done a new Silvia than the GTR.

I see no need to bring back the 510 name. They don't need to enter the hot hatch market, but if they did, it'd be sweet.

I don't know why any Nissan enthusiast wouldn't want to see a new small, lightweight *RWD* sedan/hot-hatch platform out there. Currently there are ZERO on the market.

They don't NEED a Z, or a GTR, or a Silvia any more than they need a new rwd 510 lineup. For myself, I see a MUCH greater need for a new small/lightweight/economical rwd sedan/hatch than I do for a 3300 lb. Z or 3800 lb. GT-R...

Actually, doing a 510 lineup and basing a new lighter-weight Z on that might make more sense than going head-to-head against the FR-S/BRZ. As Toyobaru has discovered, if you go into a market segment that's been overlooked for literally over a decade, you find a lot of pent-up demand and easy sales.