Synchros problem?

[csaba]

Originally Posted by Matt Andrews

mine has only about 60 miles on it. I have noticed that 1st gear has some resistance when down shifting before completely stopped, but I wouldn't consider it a crunch at all.

Are your issues on upshifts or downshifts?

If you have resistance shifting to 1st before completely stopped that's normal with any car .

[csaba]

Originally Posted by Matt Andrews

Thanks for the heads up.

I've only done it when slow rolling before a stoplight. But I will admit on a tight road course or auto cross in the future I probably would have shifted into first with a heel / toe throttle blip. (i think - I honestly haven't paid too much attention to 1st gear gearing) What is special about this transmission that prevents you from doing this?

The gearing! Other transmissions does the same

[mattles]

1-2-3 should feel a bit 'rough/crunchy' due to those wonderful triple-cone gear synchros. These were chosen to maximize durability on a high-revving, beginners RWD car. You can mercilessly beat the piss out of the first 3 gear changes, and the transmission probably wont mind a bit.

I believe the RX-8 transmission also employs the use of triple-cone synchros for durability, and that transmission feels very similar to ours (thats because it is).

Unfortunately yes, this has the very minute drawback of making the car a bit louder and rougher. Its an inexpensive sports car, guys - compromises were made in certain areas.

[synchromesh]

Originally Posted by eriktherod

I've found second gear to go really, really low which I like because I'm used to that on the Si.

I find accelerating from 2nd while rolling(walking speed) to not be a good thing. Engine makes a funny sound compared to other cars Ive owned. I refuse to ride the clutch rolling in second so Im gonna have to be doing a lot of rev-matching into 1st!

[HunterGreene]

Originally Posted by mattles

1-2-3 should feel a bit 'rough/crunchy' due to those wonderful triple-cone gear synchros. These were chosen to maximize durability on a high-revving, beginners RWD car. You can mercilessly beat the piss out of the first 3 gear changes, and the transmission probably wont mind a bit.

I believe the RX-8 transmission also employs the use of triple-cone synchros for durability, and that transmission feels very similar to ours (thats because it is).

Unfortunately yes, this has the very minute drawback of making the car a bit louder and rougher. Its an inexpensive sports car, guys - compromises were made in certain areas.

This makes complete sense. Crunchy = bad in my previous cars, so I was going from previous experience.

[brianc]

The only way to smoothly get into 1st from 2nd is to rev match into 1st. That's what I find. Either throttle blip or double clutch.

Try out Amsoil Synchromesh. I know some S2k guys use it in their transmissions to fix synchro problems.

[jdrxb9]

I am over 1100 miles and I've had concern with my 1->2 gearchange for a while now. Especially for the very first 1->2 shift in the morning there is A LOT of resistence felt in the shifter and if forced through it will occasionally grind. Once the car is warmed up, even just a couple miles, it is much better. I don't have any problems with any other gears. I will be talking to the dealer about it soon.

[ToxicSneakers]

Originally Posted by jdrxb9

I am over 1100 miles and I've had concern with my 1->2 gearchange for a while now. Especially for the very first 1->2 shift in the morning there is A LOT of resistence felt in the shifter and if forced through it will occasionally grind. Once the car is warmed up, even just a couple miles, it is much better. I don't have any problems with any other gears. I will be talking to the dealer about it soon.

Try this:
-From standing idle rpm double-clutch in neutral then shift into first (Useful when fluid is colder than normal operating temperature.).
-Accelerate in first, noting the indicated matching speeds and rpms at three points within the operational range. Practice your downshifts at preselected speeds and blip accelerator pedal to match the rpm previously noted. In practice, you will likely be shifting down at the higher rpm.

[jdrxb9]

Originally Posted by ToxicSneakers

Try this:
-From standing idle rpm double-clutch in neutral then shift into first (Useful when fluid is colder than normal operating temperature.).
-Accelerate in first, noting the indicated matching speeds and rpms at three points within the operational range. Practice your downshifts at preselected speeds and blip accelerator pedal to match the rpm previously noted. In practice, you will likely be shifting down at the higher rpm.

Note I am not having a problem shifting 2->1. With appropriate rev matching and especially with a quick double clutch to raise the input shaft speed, 2nd to 1st downshifts are not a problem. My issue is shifting 1st to 2nd, especially when cold. I probably should have put in my first post that I've been driving MT cars for 20+ years. Also, have never had a clutch or transmission issue in that time.

[ToxicSneakers]

Originally Posted by jdrxb9

Note I am not having a problem shifting 2->1. With appropriate rev matching and especially with a quick double clutch to raise the input shaft speed, 2nd to 1st downshifts are not a problem. My issue is shifting 1st to 2nd, especially when cold. I probably should have put in my first post that I've been driving MT cars for 20+ years. Also, have never had a clutch or transmission issue in that time.

Think I quoted the wrong post in error, excuse my dyslexic response please!

[davisk6]

Originally Posted by jdrxb9

I am over 1100 miles and I've had concern with my 1->2 gearchange for a while now. Especially for the very first 1->2 shift in the morning there is A LOT of resistence felt in the shifter and if forced through it will occasionally grind. Once the car is warmed up, even just a couple miles, it is much better. I don't have any problems with any other gears. I will be talking to the dealer about it soon.

I've had this happen with almost every modern manual I've owed since 2000. My Subaru's demonstrated this the worst. From my experience, this is due to the fluid used. Most factory Subaru fluid is pretty thin, to allow for quick warm up and better shifting in colder climates. The drawback is that, when the transmission is completely cold, and due to the close gear ratios used between 1st and 2nd, you'll get clunky shifts with the occasional grind.

If this is a major issue for you, and you don't live in a climate that gets very cold, like the Northeast, you can step up your transmission fluid to something thicker. The downside to this is, if the temperature does drop to say 30F, it will be harder to shift into 1st and 2nd, but you won't grind at all. I've used Motul in the past with great results. I've had mixed results with Redline.

[FRiSson]

Brought my car to the dealership and took a ride with an experienced mechanic. He liked the car a lot. What he told me was that transmissions in a RWD car had less room and therefore used smaller synchronizers than FWD cars. Since I have driven FWD cars for the last 17 years and Hondas at that, I have been comparing two different transmission styles. I don't know enough about transmissions to verify what he said, but in any case, I now have the concern registered with the dealership. If the crunchiness issue doesn't get worse, that's fine. It's something I can live with.

[HunterGreene]

Originally Posted by FRiSson

Brought my car to the dealership and took a ride with an experienced mechanic. He liked the car a lot. What he told me was that transmissions in a RWD car had less room and therefore used smaller synchronizers than FWD cars. Since I have driven FWD cars for the last 17 years and Hondas at that, I have been comparing two different transmission styles. I don't know enough about transmissions to verify what he said, but in any case, I now have the concern registered with the dealership. If the crunchiness issue doesn't get worse, that's fine. It's something I can live with.

Smart move, keep a paper trail. Keep us updated with any new developments!

[eriktherod]

Indeed, I always reported any issues I had with the car when I took my Si in for service. If you have a record of issues before the warranty is up, there is a good chance they will do the repair on "good faith" once you are just barely out of warranty.

[pyro530]

Originally Posted by FRiSson

Just a couple of notes, I have been using manual shift cars for thirty years and never had a transmission that required service, or had to replace a clutch (even after 155,000 original miles). So, my shift style is not to blame. The problem is inconsistent, but appears to be getting worse, so I will be bringing it to the attention of the dealer. The issue appears when getting into first for the initial start up and then into second gear. Example: heavy traffic, I slow down a bit while in second, then switch into neutral, I put the car back into second, at about 22 mph, but it takes a fair amount of push and noise to get it back into gear. The overall feeling of getting into gear at this point is not smooth at all. The feeling is similar to well-worn synchros on an old transmission. What I wanted to know is if other people are experiencing this.

Yes.
When I first get in the car in the AM 2nd gear requires a little muscle to get into and sometimes I can feel a couple cogs slipping by as it does go into gear.
I was just thinking it was because it's a new transmission and everything is a little tight.

[Gen]

Originally Posted by csaba

If you have resistance shifting to 1st before completely stopped that's normal with any car .

What he said!

I've never driven a car that will easily shift to first once the car is moving.

[FRiSson]

After 3,000 miles, the "crunchiness" of the 2nd gear is much reduced. Shifting is much smoother, except when the engine/transmission are cold.

[#87]

Originally Posted by vividracing

1st gear should only be used to get the car moving. Once you're rolling, 2nd gear should be adequate. This goes for all cars, not just the FR-S.

Well if you apply any throttle in 2nd gear and aren't around 10-12 MPH it lugs bad in this car, so I find myself in 1st usually to 12-15 mph under normal acceleration

[Lytheum]

the car doesnt sound like it likes second gear at low rpms. i never used 1st gear after moving in my speed 3, but the brz i tend to shift into first if im crawling <5 mph. I have to go over a curb/speedbump everyday and it shifts into first with no extra effort at very low speeds. would never try it going more then 5mph.

[df.dima]

I also have issues shifting into 2nd when car is cold. Once warmed up its easier. I think its a 'feature', rather than a problem (based on other people's experience), but will keep monitoring. Im only at 500km or so.

[sierra]

Originally Posted by FRiSson

Brought my car to the dealership and took a ride with an experienced mechanic. He liked the car a lot. What he told me was that transmissions in a RWD car had less room and therefore used smaller synchronizers than FWD cars.

If anything RWD has more room for the gearbox than FWD.
The gearbox will free up over time but it wouldn't hurt to ask the dealer to check the oil level.
If they question that, point out that one has already been found with virtually no oil from the factory, after it destroyed itself.

[kramerica_industries]

**I posted this in another thread but I think it applies to the OP***. The transmission is Aisin and it's a very close relative to the manual gearbox in the RWD 6MT used in the Lexus IS250. I drove a 2006 MT IS250 for two years, from brand new until 2008 (approx 35,000 miles). From my experience, I have heard VERY similar noises as described by the OP. I even had the infamous "jar of marbles" sound when shifting lower gears at slower speeds. I never had any mechanical problems with the IS MT clutch or tranny. I sold it to a work colleague and she and her husband drove it another 25k miles with no issues. I'm not saying you don't have an issue to be addressed, but I can say from my experiences the tranny and clutch did have a few quirky noises in my IS. BTW - I drove that IS hard and loved every minute of it.