To those who keep comparing the FRS to another car on specs...

[thill]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

DUde, the FC3S RX7's were totally awesome in it's days. It still is. Some blame Mazda for its likeness to a Porsche 944 but I don't think that is something to be upset with.

Turbo II's and Japanese Enfini RX7 in various trim were the fun cars of the early 90s!!! Too bad they all fell apart a bit early, and despite the high initial sales, the car just couldn't stay together without some passionate upkeep in later years after 10 years. Still love those things.

I was very lucky. My father was a custom home builder and was doing a job for a judge and his wife and the Turbo II was her car. She barely drove it (it was a fun weekend car) and the car looked like it had been in a showroom. I asked her about the car (I drove a 1986 RX-7 GXL at the time) and she told me she wanted to sell it and get a car with an automatic... The rest was history..

The car ran without issues (well, outside of all the care and feeding you had to do for the rotary) but I joined the military and the car was becoming too hard to keep up and I needed something for inclement weather.. Looking back, I should have kept it...

Memories

[Tbomb 25]

Originally Posted by thill

I was very lucky. My father was a custom home builder and was doing a job for a judge and his wife and the Turbo II was her car. She barely drove it (it was a fun weekend car) and the car looked like it had been in a showroom. I asked her about the car (I drove a 1986 RX-7 GXL at the time) and she told me she wanted to sell it and get a car with an automatic... The rest was history..

The car ran without issues (well, outside of all the care and feeding you had to do for the rotary) but I joined the military and the car was becoming too hard to keep up and I needed something for inclement weather.. Looking back, I should have kept it...

Memories

Very cool....i grew up in a RX-7 and in my dads friends 240z's im 38 years old in 79 when the RX7 just hit with clout that the Ft86/BRZ/FRS has i was 5 years old and i remember everything about that car and the great times i had and that special look on my dads face when he was behind the wheel only special drivers cars can get kind of reaction and fond memories...i grew up a rotary head. This car reminds me of that 1st FB RX7 just very pure and unexplainable...

[Bristecom]

Originally Posted by Fish

Well said Moto. I had to literally stand up and applaud.

The FR-S was the only car that made me willing to give up my Evo 8 since I got it 5 years ago. Sure I can feel the power difference, but I feel the car as a whole makes up for it. The way it handles, the hum of the engine, the sleek body lines on the car. To me it's everything they claimed it would be and what it would represent - passion. I will miss my old car, but I don't regret giving it up.

I have an Eclipse GSX and I like it even more than the Evo's. My Eclipse is simply more fun. The Evo was just a little too tall and long with more body roll. But the Recaro seats and Momo steering wheel on those were probably the best I've ever felt. How do you think they compare to your FR-S? I personally think the seats on the FR-S hug you a little more which I like but the Recaros still felt amazing in leather. And I still think I prefer the Momo steering wheel over the FR-S wheel but it's still darn good. Oh and what about the shifting? How do you think that compares?

[Moto-P]

Originally Posted by Bristecom

I have an Eclipse GSX and I like it even more than the Evo's. My Eclipse is simply more fun. The Evo was just a little too tall and long with more body roll. But the Recaro seats and Momo steering wheel on those were probably the best I've ever felt. How do you think they compare to your FR-S? I personally think the seats on the FR-S hug you a little more which I like but the Recaros still felt amazing in leather. And I still think I prefer the Momo steering wheel over the FR-S wheel but it's still darn good. Oh and what about the shifting? How do you think that compares?

Well, despite the similar size and all, the Eclipse is an AWD car with a turbo. There's a small bit of lag, and loads of torque, and transferred through AWD, it does cover ground quickly, especially in incliment weather roads. But because of this, there's a lot of technology for its time, bolted on to the car for the pursuit of sheer speed for the money. More often than not, this makes the car less communicative, and unpredictable in many ways when we're treading on fine balance of uppper limits of adhesion. This is not to say that that is a negative, as all forms of WRC Rally cars rely on these technology, and more, and is the only way they win those stages. Think of it as a F16 jet, with full load of arsenal.

IN contrast, the FRS is more an interactive experience focus. The engine is naturally aspirated, very communicative, and RWD and lack of electronics (when turned off) can be more tactile and through enjoyable in a different way. It's more catered to perhaps, a propeller race plane, with all the finer feedback and less fly-by wire assists. And every G force you induce gets emotionally and intrinsically fed back your your nerves.

Both have it's focus, and one being 20-10 years in gap... And it really is a matter of preference and choice, but behind the wheel, the two are completely almost opposite in feel. And I do LIKE them both in different ways.

[ayau]

moto san, where did you buy the clear side markers?

[Bristecom]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

Well, despite the similar size and all, the Eclipse is an AWD car with a turbo. There's a small bit of lag, and loads of torque, and transferred through AWD, it does cover ground quickly, especially in incliment weather roads. But because of this, there's a lot of technology for its time, bolted on to the car for the pursuit of sheer speed for the money. More often than not, this makes the car less communicative, and unpredictable in many ways when we're treading on fine balance of uppper limits of adhesion. This is not to say that that is a negative, as all forms of WRC Rally cars rely on these technology, and more, and is the only way they win those stages. Think of it as a F16 jet, with full load of arsenal.

IN contrast, the FRS is more an interactive experience focus. The engine is naturally aspirated, very communicative, and RWD and lack of electronics (when turned off) can be more tactile and through enjoyable in a different way. It's more catered to perhaps, a propeller race plane, with all the finer feedback and less fly-by wire assists. And every G force you induce gets emotionally and intrinsically fed back your your nerves.

Both have it's focus, and one being 20-10 years in gap... And it really is a matter of preference and choice, but behind the wheel, the two are completely almost opposite in feel. And I do LIKE them both in different ways.

Yeah, that's about right. Although my Eclipse doesn't use any electronics aside from ABS and fuel injection. It has viscous coupling differentials like the original Evo used. But the newer Evo's are even less predictable because of their electronic differentials and higher center of gravity. And believe it or not, my Eclipse has more feel and feedback than the FR-S (according to my test drive). The FR-S feels smooth and comfortable compared to it (not that my Eclipse is uncomfortable).

But yes, even though the Eclipse has a tiny turbo, it still has a bit of lag and the AWD drivetrain can bog down a bit. But as you say, for the money and for its time, the performance is just awesome. I can floor it in any condition and it won't slip at all. Or in the snow I can pull off beautiful drifts and completely own everyone else on the road (unless an STI or Evo pulls up with snow tires).

But the FR-S drivetrain definitely feels more direct and its balance is slight oversteer rather than slight understeer. So in that sense their driving characteristics are opposite. And the FR-S ****pit is even more focused and lower down despite being the same size. They really are two completely different cars. But both are great and fun in their own ways. Which is why I have decided to keep the Eclipse for snow or backup duty and will have the FR-S as a daily driver. I am so excited about this resolution because now I can justify keeping my Eclipse.

The Eclipse GSX is my AE86. It's the car that got me into cars. And for that, it should always deserve a place in my garage. But I think the FR-S will bring a whole new stage to my driving "career." It has already redefined what I thought I wanted from a car and should make me an even better driver whilst delivering plenty of good times.

[Moto-P]

Originally Posted by ayau

moto san, where did you buy the clear side markers?

I traded with a fellow Toyota 86 owner in Japan.
He wanted Scion US stuff more than I wanted anything yet. LOL

[Touge Monster]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

I traded with a fellow Toyota 86 owner in Japan.
He wanted Scion US stuff more than I wanted anything yet. LOL

Lol I noticed the sw20 mr2 guys in japan love the usdm amber turn signals too, need to set up some JDM/usdm parts exchange program ; )

[Aznek]

Any more pics of the the red concept?

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Bristecom

I have an Eclipse GSX and I like it even more than the Evo's. My Eclipse is simply more fun. The Evo was just a little too tall and long with more body roll. But the Recaro seats and Momo steering wheel on those were probably the best I've ever felt. How do you think they compare to your FR-S? I personally think the seats on the FR-S hug you a little more which I like but the Recaros still felt amazing in leather. And I still think I prefer the Momo steering wheel over the FR-S wheel but it's still darn good. Oh and what about the shifting? How do you think that compares?

For me I wanted an Evo for as long as I could remember. I was stoked the day I finally got my 8. Comparing the steering wheels, I think the FR-S is just a little bit more comfortable. But I think if I had to pick, I'd get the MOMO one all over again. I agree on the seats. The FR-S ones do hug you a little tighter. I think I'd be hard pressed to pick between one of the 2. As far as the shifting goes, the Evo is more firm. Kinda like it pops into gear with a little more feeling I guess. I could also tell more easily what gear I'm shifting to or what gear it's in. But on the FR-S its more smooth. Every shift just slides right in while still giving it this kind of direct feeling to it.

I should mention though I got my Evo used with like 42k miles.

[ayau]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

I traded with a fellow Toyota 86 owner in Japan.
He wanted Scion US stuff more than I wanted anything yet. LOL

if you know someone who's willing to do the same thing, please let me know. i'm really not liking the amber turn signals lol.

[Exhaust]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

It's SSR Type C-RS, 17x7.5 +42. (OOOPS edited: They are 18x7.5 +42 with 5mm spacers, and 225/40-18 Falken Azenis RT615K)

It's actually a set made for Prius by VIP AUTO Salon in Orange,CA, who happened to be retiring the Mio Prius project car, and his set was available for me to use for a few months. I bought some Falken RT615 since I have a track day coming up in June and wanted to just decorate it up a bit for the two shows it will be attending this month as well.

The offset isn't ideal so I slipped a 5mm spacer in the rear, and waiting on 10mm adapter spacer before the track event. Eventually I will work out a good fitment and get my other set sometime in August when all scheduled suspension settings and alignment are complete and I can actually get the true and accurate measure of where my wheels will sit against the fenders (as well as dynamic point of ideal load on hubs.)

Well they are very attractive, congratulations. Would you recommend a 5mm space all around or simply just the back? You think you need to go any higher than 5? with that being said, how do those wheels handle? Of course its hard to say considering you havent tracked them yet(?), but a little curios as far as your day-to-day

[Moto-P]

Originally Posted by ayau

if you know someone who's willing to do the same thing, please let me know. i'm really not liking the amber turn signals lol.

Yeah, I'll let you all now if there are more people among my contacts in Japan.

[Calidrifter]

I remember my evo8 that thing was beast. But the turning was just too unresponsive/understeer for me (upgraded from a 240). So I returned it to the dealer and got my S14 back.

Unfortunately the S14 was only good for another couple of months before it started having major issues. Which is when I traded it in for my truck. But still miss both of those cars very much.

[Moto-P]

Originally Posted by Exhaust

Well they are very attractive, congratulations. Would you recommend a 5mm space all around or simply just the back? You think you need to go any higher than 5? with that being said, how do those wheels handle? Of course its hard to say considering you haven't tracked them yet(?), but a little curios as far as your day-to-day

The wheels are slightly lighter than stock ones, and the tires are slightly heavier. However, the overall ride qualities in town and highway, despite the 18" size and thinner walls, and the stiffer ST racing construction and compound RT615K, the ride is fairly unchanged. The reason I have 5mm spacers is the fact that the temporary set of wheels I have are actually for a Prius, at 18x7.5 +42 and wanted a bit more track widths pushing them out by 5mm on both sides.

Much of improvement in ride qualities despite the drop is much more attributed to the RS*R Sports-i coil-overs however, which has a wide adjustment to make street use more compliant than stock, while having the ability to set aggressively for the track, and more importantly, the mono-tube patented long-stroke valve and piston design they use on these Super-i series dampers. In spirited drives, through casual under-limit exercises of the tires, the whole car with this setup, exhibited superb handling and predictability as afforded originally, yet has capacities to take larger loads with higher spring rates without ever becoming harsh on ride.

With the new-found grip levels, I can wish for more torque at about 4000-6000 range to reduce uphill gear changes, and fight the increased load on the LSD in tighter turns, overall that is wishful thinking and something I can try to take care of over the next few years, right? Whenever 3rd party guys figure out how to raise the power of this sophisticated engine with 4D-S.

So far, if you have the means, I recommend any of the choices I made thus far, if you have the same intent with the car. It is a pricey set of options, but a car like this doesn't improve on cheap diet of parts. However, try to put it this way, and plan to keep the car for many more years than your usual 4-5 year swap. And partake in many events, local sanctioned races, and other motorsports activities. Keep developing as a driver, over long ownership and with the long-term goals, your investments might just become more justifiable than buying inferior stuff over and over.

I do note that the wheel size and offset is temporary for me, as I think more ideally it should be on the 18x8.0 +46 as TRD specs its cars for N1 and VLN. But for visual appeal, I see no reason to not go a bit wider track with +30 or so offsets to flush out the tire to fender.

The 225/40-18's did heat up nicely, and I suppose you can go for 235 as well if you like wider, taller sizes. But keep in mind too, that this car is mere 2700+ lbs, and excessively wide tires will reduce the available power with larger contact patch, and also may prevent proper heating of the tires with lack of contact pressure on such large patch. Such will shave fractions of seconds on tighter auto-crosses, but also sort of take away from the inherent balance of power and fun factor, in exchange for the increased grip and resulting overall speed. If you simply enjoy tossing it around, and occasionally feeling for counter-steering fun, stay with a mild width tire of milder compounds.

[nix]

You've driven M3s, blacktop ae86, you know the feel of a drivers engine and you talk about a desire for more torque. With my GT4 or Supra, Toyota gave me a real canvas to paint on with bolt ons to deliver my own experience. The FA20 has a much lower ceiling. I hope a reflash, supercharger and intake/exhaust will be enough but I'm kind of worried.

[Slartibartfast]

Originally Posted by Moto-P

Yeah, I'll let you all now if there are more people among my contacts in Japan.

This should be a whole new thread. Hell, should be a whole new website.
jdm-usdmSwap.com? lol
I hate the orange lenses for the corner marker. Going to swap them for clear as soon as my car gets here.

ok, back on topic.
Moto-P you are a fantastic representation of what this forum is all about. Thank you for your OP.