FR-S in inclement weather

[kounkong23]

Hey everyone! So I think everyone will agree with me when I say I'm in the market for a new car and this thing needs to HURRY UP. Currently, I've been doing research on the Genesis Coupe and I am waiting to see the 2012 model. I've driven the car a few times and I must say, it is a very fun drive my friends. However, before I can make a well-rounded decision, I want to wait for the FRS to come out and do a side-by-side comparison. I know, I know, for those of you that are diehards of FRS, you say the Genesis is junk. BUT I hope you agree when I say it's kinda difficult to look at anything else right now since the FRS isn't out yet. One thing that I'm taking into consideration that I haven't seen at all talked about on these forums, is the concern of the FRS during inclement weather, specifically in snow. I live in Minnesota and it is definitely one of the top concerns for me. Most sports car owners put away their babies for the winter but I kinda can't do that (would involve getting another car for winter). Now since the FRS is designed to appeal to pure sport car enthusiasts, a tuner car, and supposed to be really light, I'm thinking it won't stand up during the harsh winters here. Any thoughts?

[Exage]

Snow? RWD? Not recommended. Depends on how much snow, how good your snow tires are, and how good you are at driving in the white stuff.

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by Exage

Snow? RWD? Not recommended. Depends on how much snow, how good your snow tires are, and how good you are at driving in the white stuff.

It depends Exage. I did just fine on ICE in a RWD Ranger, which could be the poster child for bad winter vehicle after low riders or muscle cars. Granted it was my second and third year of driving that I went with my truck instead of borrowing the family minivan on snow days. I also got stuck if I ever left the main road for a second but that's a fact of life for any open diff RWD truck with old all-season tires.

kounkong23, it depends a lot on your skill what you winter drive. Good tires and a FWD car can still spell disaster. FWD is worse IMHO, because you can't add more weight to the front end nor would you want to and when traction is poor you can lose all steering.

I actually found a guy on a Gen coupe forum who just bought a Gen coupe and had pictures of it with winter tires/wheels. It came up because someone mentioned the "bad" wheels and the guy responded with something like, "oh those? they're my winter wheels."

Plenty of people DD their BMWs, Mercedes-Benz, and such in Germany they get some nasty winters but I would bet that they switch to winter wheels/tires and carry a set of chains just in case.

If you want some good advice on it consult the moderators on NASIOC . I was reading the Geneva thread and there was no less than 10 forum vets defending RWD in winter weather with 2 guys playing the AWD only for Snow card . It's shameful how ignorant people can be. But even with me saying this, I would still recommend consulting someone with more experience in this than myself .

[Dimman]

In my opinion, with good tires ground clearance in the important factor in snow. FWD, RWD just changes how the car reacts when it's slippery.

Get good winter/snow&ice tires, drive smoothly and be aware of what's happening further ahead are good starting points.

[OldSkoolToys]

Originally Posted by Dimman

In my opinion, with good tires ground clearance in the important factor in snow. FWD, RWD just changes how the car reacts when it's slippery.

Get good winter/snow&ice tires, drive smoothly and be aware of what's happening further ahead are good starting points.

Eh, there's a notable difference...unless said RWD car is MR/RR. FWD has the weight on the drive wheels, which helps them maintain traction.

Also, losing grip in the front is a bit easier to regain control and traction than the rear most the time. Once the rear gets loose in extremely slippery conditions, most the time all you can do brake, counter-steer, and hope you're not on a hill.

Though interesting enough, in snow/ice, you're not supposed to counter-steer when the rear gets loose, instead, steer into it.

Of course nothing beats just having a spare set of steelies with winter tires mounted on them. If I lived back up North I would have them on my old pizza cutters (factory rims).

[iff2mastamatt]

The tires are the biggest factor, but it depends on how much snow you have to deal with. I get it maybe 4-5 times per year, and that would be anything from 1"-12". So most of the time having a RWD car wouldn't matter. However, if you consistently get snow for months on end and you need this car in extreme situations, then it's probably not good to get for a DD.

[Dimman]

Originally Posted by OldSkoolToys

Eh, there's a notable difference...unless said RWD car is MR/RR. FWD has the weight on the drive wheels, which helps them maintain traction.

Also, losing grip in the front is a bit easier to regain control and traction than the rear most the time. Once the rear gets loose in extremely slippery conditions, most the time all you can do brake, counter-steer, and hope you're not on a hill.

Though interesting enough, in snow/ice, you're not supposed to counter-steer when the rear gets loose, instead, steer into it.

Of course nothing beats just having a spare set of steelies with winter tires mounted on them. If I lived back up North I would have them on my old pizza cutters (factory rims).

Meh... With good tires there is little difference if you don't drive like a retard.

Personal extreme winter experience: Prince George, BC (Google maps, it's pretty North) 2WD Chevy 3/4 ton all seasons, Honda Civic with summer performance then studless winters.

The Civic with the studless winters was obviously the best, but there were times when the snow was too deep for it.

Then the Chevy truck with the all seasons. Drive smooth to keep the ass-end in line

Last place was when I was poor and drove 'til Feb in the Civic with no-name summer 'performance' tires. Plan braking well in advance, leave lots of room for the car ahead of you, watch 2 cars ahead, don't stop on a hill, manage your momentum and obey those special speed limits for the curves. And drive smooth.

And I'm pretty sure when they say 'steer into it', it's just counter steering. I never did anything differently to handle the back end stepping out.

With a lighter car it has a few benefits. It has less inertia so it can stop better, and it's easier to push out if you do get stuck.

Up north it was usually the 4X4 trucks and SUVs that were off the road most. People get cocky in them and don't drive for conditions, or don't feel they need anything more than all season tires.

Top rules: Get the best winter tires you can afford. Be as smooth a possible when you drive. Drive like a grandma. Don't let your pride get you into an accident.

[iff2mastamatt]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Meh... With good tires there is little difference if you don't drive like a retard.

Personal extreme winter experience: Prince George, BC (Google maps, it's pretty North) 2WD Chevy 3/4 ton all seasons, Honda Civic with summer performance then studless winters.

The Civic with the studless winters was obviously the best, but there were times when the snow was too deep for it.

Then the Chevy truck with the all seasons. Drive smooth to keep the ass-end in line

Last place was when I was poor and drove 'til Feb in the Civic with no-name summer 'performance' tires. Plan braking well in advance, leave lots of room for the car ahead of you, watch 2 cars ahead, don't stop on a hill, manage your momentum and obey those special speed limits for the curves. And drive smooth.

And I'm pretty sure when they say 'steer into it', it's just counter steering. I never did anything differently to handle the back end stepping out.

With a lighter car it has a few benefits. It has less inertia so it can stop better, and it's easier to push out if you do get stuck.

Up north it was usually the 4X4 trucks and SUVs that were off the road most. People get cocky in them and don't drive for conditions, or don't feel they need anything more than all season tires.

Top rules: Get the best winter tires you can afford. Be as smooth a possible when you drive. Drive like a grandma. Don't let your pride get you into an accident.

People in 4WD think that they can drive like maniacs and be fine in the snow. Then they end up in a fence .

For my purposes, I would either carpool or use public transportation to get to work on a day with inclement weather because it would only be maybe 4-5 days per year at the worst.

Buy a car that will make you feel safe and confident, above all else.

[ToyotaObsession]

Originally Posted by Dimman

Meh... With good tires there is little difference if you don't drive like a retard.

Personal extreme winter experience: Prince George, BC (Google maps, it's pretty North) 2WD Chevy 3/4 ton all seasons, Honda Civic with summer performance then studless winters.

The Civic with the studless winters was obviously the best, but there were times when the snow was too deep for it.

Then the Chevy truck with the all seasons. Drive smooth to keep the ass-end in line

Last place was when I was poor and drove 'til Feb in the Civic with no-name summer 'performance' tires. Plan braking well in advance, leave lots of room for the car ahead of you, watch 2 cars ahead, don't stop on a hill, manage your momentum and obey those special speed limits for the curves. And drive smooth.

And I'm pretty sure when they say 'steer into it', it's just counter steering. I never did anything differently to handle the back end stepping out.

With a lighter car it has a few benefits. It has less inertia so it can stop better, and it's easier to push out if you do get stuck.

Up north it was usually the 4X4 trucks and SUVs that were off the road most. People get cocky in them and don't drive for conditions, or don't feel they need anything more than all season tires.

Top rules: Get the best winter tires you can afford. Be as smooth a possible when you drive. Drive like a grandma. Don't let your pride get you into an accident.

Till you're on a slide slope. Now suddenly the rear of the car is sliding down the slope.

In a FWD the front end of the car (the heavy end) is still up top getting more traction driving the car more forward. While RWD is down the slope fighting to go up and forward. Seen this around my own house during the winter.

They are two completely different driving experiences on ice.

Good tires are a factor, but so is driver skill. RWD tends to be more finicky as oversteer takes effect. While FWD tend to understeer which is easier to control.

In a state like that where you can get huge snow drifts I think clearance is the biggest issue. Get 3 or 4 inches of snow on the ground and start scraping your bumper/underbody it's going to slow you down a lot. Deep enough snow and you'll get high centered.

That's why most people with Sports Cars don't drive them in the winter. I wouldn't like to drive any sports car in the snow. But I can do it.

Get's really fun in my XRunner with Summer tires lol. That light ass rear loves to come out at the slightest turn.

[Allch Chcar]

Originally Posted by Dimman

And I'm pretty sure when they say 'steer into it', it's just counter steering. I never did anything differently to handle the back end stepping out.

Good catch, I saw that and was stilling thinking, "wut?"
That is the definition of counter-steer to steer into the slide as opposed to away from it.

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

Till you're on a slide slope. Now suddenly the rear of the car is sliding down the slope.

In a FWD the front end of the car (the heavy end) is still up top getting more traction driving the car more forward. While RWD is down the slope fighting to go up and forward. Seen this around my own house during the winter.

They are two completely different driving experiences on ice.

Good tires are a factor, but so is driver skill. RWD tends to be more finicky as oversteer takes effect. While FWD tend to understeer which is easier to control...

That's why I add sandbags to the rear. RWD gives better traction to the drive wheel under acceleration but in a nose heavy car most of the traction at low speeds is on the front wheels which is better for control/steering but bad for acceleration.

Originally Posted by ToyotaObsession

...Get's really fun in my XRunner with Summer tires lol. That light ass rear loves to come out at the slightest turn.

I've been there but with all-season tires :|. As I said sandbags really calmed that wheelspin down for me but I did try it without sandbags to save on the tiny bit of gas and it was still doable to drive on a sheet of ice at 30-35mph but if I pushed it that tail it would start shaking D: Nothing more embarrassing than your car shaking it's tail at other drivers scaring them and backing up traffic . Needless to say I put the sandbags back until the ice melted.

[kounkong23]

Decisions, decisions... still leaning towards awesome sports car and riding the bus in the winter haha.

[WingsofWar]

I drove my 87 Rx-7 TII in the snow and it did just fine...car weighs less than 2700 right now. You dont need to put your sports car in for the winter..but you should be smart about your driving habits during icey snowy conditions. That goes for any vehicle regardless of the drive type.

Smart and skilled driving out performs any car on the road.

[Random_Art]

Originally Posted by WingsofWar

I drove my 87 Rx-7 TII in the snow and it did just fine...car weighs less than 2700 right now. You dont need to put your sports car in for the winter..but you should be smart about your driving habits during icey snowy conditions. That goes for any vehicle regardless of the drive type.

Smart and skilled driving out performs any car on the road.

Indeed. I've actually spun out more in FWD vehicles in the snow than in RWD vehicles. Its really all in how you drive it.

[bofa]

Just a personal preference but I like to keep my cars in showroom condition. Snow is a bad recipe for clearance, debris, icing, salt, etc. If I'm driving in that kind of crap I'd rather have my Xterra or my old jeep. Sure I could make it in my Z, but why risk it?