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Old 09-06-2015, 10:35 PM   #41
jmimac351
Chin Chief Instructor
 
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Originally Posted by Alan View Post

For both @JMimacc351 and @gatorac, are you using 4 points because a five or six point would require a fixed seat and thus disable side airbags? I am prepared to do a half cage and seats in the car. I am not so comfortable with losing airbags as I plan to continue to drive to and from the track. Defeating standard safety equipment as a part of a system does not sit well with me. The issue of using three-point belts with a fixed-back seat also concerns me.

If I can't find a workable solution, I will likely sell the car and get an E36 without side airbags. I figure that allows me to drive to and from the track AND do a half cage, seats, six points and HANS. But I will really miss my BRZ if that happens.

Note, the safety discussion has been becoming more prevalent at some group's track days. NASA Northeast devotes an entire classroom session each weekend to these issues.
Alan, for me... the main issue is whether it's contested passing (racing) or HPDE events with agreed point-by passing.

Racing = full cage, fire suit, fire suppression, etc... Everything. That's what we have in our ChumpCar Miata.

However, I'm doing HPDE events with Chin Motorsports... these are some of the things that go through my mind and influence my plan. The important thing is to keep your eyes and ears open for better ideas and feedback.
  • I would buy or mod, as necessary, in order to have a H&N device. That is my top priority.
  • I like the stock BRZ seat, all things considered. In the stock setup I've experienced the sore knee-sides from bracing. Pomroy (GatorAC) says the Schroth 4 point holds him in the seat without needing to brace in the same manner. That Schroth 4 point also allows me to use my "DefNder" H&N device - which I already own. If that works for me then it means I can keep the stock seat (airbags), use my H&N restraint, stay planted in the car, and save $$$ for Ballast Point Sculpin. Sounds like a tasty place to start, for me.
  • In MY opinion, the BRZ doesn't need a "roll bar", given the way I'll use the car. Consider my perspective though... I'm coming out of a Panoz GTRA, then on to a number of Miatas. Based on my own research, I'm satisfied with the strength of the roof - for my needs. I don't think I need a full cage, half cage, or 4pt bar, as I am not doing contested passing and worrying about a hammerhead trying to bonsai pass me (heavy side impact). The track I most often run at, Sebring, means a side impact is likely into tires. I'll take the side impact protection and side curtain airbags designed into the BRZ for that. Could a side impact with another car happen at an HPDE event? Yes. Is it likely? EXTREMELY unlikely. That's MY choice.
  • I want to be able to drive the car to the track in a very streetable form, with wheels / tires in the back.
  • I don't want to hack up a brand new car, and, I don't think I NEED to hack up a brand new car. Even with that said, my choice is based on what I think is appropriate for what I'm doing. I just happen to think I'm able to meet my need of a H&N restraint without a bar, and I'm not trying to makeup for the shortcomings of a Miata in a rollover.
  • I drive within my limits. My close calls are usually due to a mistake, not over-driving. Know yourself and what you need to do to your car to, in good faith, be safe.
  • Do not let the illusion of safety and the fact that you haven't had an issue let you become complacent about what you know you need to do.

Is putting a half cage, full cage, or 4pt bar in a BRZ for HPDE events a bad idea? If it works with how you use the car otherwise... my opinion is: Nope. Anything less than a full cage, fire suit, fire suppression, etc in a car on a race track can be said to be less safe than a "street car" on a race track.

We've all tried to explain to those we know / work with what we do. They may think what we do is a little "risky". We've all seen their eyes glaze over when we try to explain it. The important thing is that I know that I'm not being "reckless".

Each of us has to, in good faith, think about what we are doing with the car on a race track. Then we have to make our own choices. People will make different choices. The Bullshyte stops at Pit Out.

As I said, be open to other ideas and feedback. I am.
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